Clermont City Council Transcript 4/28/26

9:36 attend council meetings online. In the interest of time, efficiency and ensuring everyone who wishes to address
9:44 the council is given the opportunity to do so. The following will apply to all comments made by the per by the public in person and virtually. Each speaker
9:51 will be be permitted three minutes to address the council. In the effort to be respectful during the meeting, please make sure your cell phones are set to silence.
10:01 Thank you for participating in your city government. Um, tonight's invocation will be given by Father Mark Wer
10:09 uh from Blessed Sacramento Catholic Church. Please rise and remain standing for the pledge of alle allegiance.
10:17 Good afternoon everyone. If you'd like to bow your heads and pray with me.
10:21 Heavenly Father, creator of all things and the giver of all good gifts, we thank you for having the privilege of serving our city of Clermont. I pray,
10:29 Father, that as we discuss our agenda and craft policies for our city, we will always put the people's interests above our own. I ask that you watch over our mayor, Tim Murry, the council members,
10:39 and all who serve here. As we approach summer, I ask that you keep our police,
10:44 firefighters, and all first responders under your watchful eye and safe from harm. You've said that citizens should obey the governing authorities since you
10:52 have established those very authorities to promote peace and order and justice.
10:57 We ask that they will continue to guide our great city of Clermont. Remind us,
11:01 Father, that we are in this position to be served, not uh to not not to be served, but to serve the public and to help those less fortunate. I also pray,
11:11 Father, that we will uphold what is moral and rational. In your holy name we pray. Amen. Amen.
11:20 Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation
11:28 under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you. Please be seated.
11:36 Thank you, Father Wade. Wade.
11:40 Uh tonight we have uh two presentations this afternoon. Uh the first one we have the city employee of the year of the quarter.
11:51 Thank you Mr. Mayor and in council. So the champion of the quarter program began in January of this year and it was to recognize our outstanding champions
12:00 that work for the city. So employees are nominated based on their b they're are nominated by their peers based on four categories. One of them being leading with integrity, compassion,
12:10 adaptability, and responsibly stewarding resources. So, the city's manager's office personnel review all nominees and then vote and select their quarterly
12:18 winner. This quarter, we had four outstanding nominees. And on behalf of the city manager's office, we'd like to recognize Lieutenant Nicholas Bloom with
12:26 the Clermont Police Department for being selected as our first quarterly champion. So if Nicholas can come up here with Chief Gracig.
12:42 So Lieutenant Bloom was nominated by Ramsay Gimenez and she wrote that Lieutenant Bloom consistently goes above
12:50 and beyond his normal duties and shows a strong commitment to the city. He leads with integrity and responsibility,
12:56 stewards city resources. He takes pride in his work and is always willing to help others. In addition, the kindness and compassion he shows towards
13:03 co-workers create a positive work environment and have earned him the trust and respect of those around him.
13:10 So, congratulations again, Lieutenant Bloom.
13:17 Mr. Mr. Uh, Matthew,
13:22 this well uh um Lieutenant Bloom, you want to come back? I think uh the the city
13:31 manager need to come down and get a photo. You actually work for him as well. So, but I uh this is the Yes, this is the uh first one, but um since the
13:40 first one, can you share with us some of the criterias for this for this? So the criteria is that so the way we do it is we we do one per quarter and it's
13:50 in in we tried to separate it out by department so it's it's for it's fair.
13:54 So the January to through March we have the police and fire are eligible for nominees. April through June is public services because of the size of there.
14:02 And then July through September, it's planning, building, the clerk's office,
14:05 and parks and recreation. And then the last quarter is procurement, finance, economic development, human resources,
14:11 and IT. But we they're nominated based on those four criteria. Leading with integrity, compassion, adaptability, and responsibly stewarding resources.
14:20 Okay. So they once we get all the nominations,
14:22 we we take a look at them. the the city manager's office. So, it's Rick, myself,
14:27 Melinda, Zayn, uh, and Debbie are the ones that kind of select and Jennifer,
14:33 sorry, I didn't mean to leave Jennifer out. Sorry. Okay.
14:35 She also we we collectively look at all the nominees and we vote and then Zayn compiles all the votes and he tells us
14:42 who wins and we're we're very proud that the Lieutenant Bloom was our first winner so far in this new program. Okay. Well, good. Well, I thank him.
14:51 Congratulations. and I appreciate and I I know he's a hard worker. He been around here quite quite some time doing doing his job. And as I always say, I
14:58 know we got some outstanding officers down there because we got the best police department I've ever been associated with and I've ever been around. So So congratulations,
15:06 Lieutenant, you know. Uh um now the second one is the annual comprehensive financial report.
15:30 1436 Scott Bore Finance Director. Thank you,
15:36 Mayor and City Council. It's my pleasure to present to you the uh fiscal year and uh September 30th, 2025 independent
15:43 auditor reports. And I'd like to introduce Miss uh Heather Moer from the firm Car Rig Z Ingram who conducted the
15:50 reports on behalf of the city or for the city I should say. Uh Heather will provide with you uh an overview of the process, the findings and then
15:59 afterwards we'll be glad to answer any questions that the council may have. Good afternoon.
16:08 As he said, I'm Heather Moer. I'm the partner uh the audit partner at Car Rigs and Ingram uh performing your financial audit. This is our second year doing this for the city. Uh just keep in mind
16:18 also I'm going to talk about the results of the audit, but when I do that it's also going to be talking about the CRA results as well because you know that gets an independent uh financial report as well.
16:28 Uh so we issue our audit opinion uh within the financial statements and what that
16:37 is is stating if your financial statements are materially misstated or not. uh through that we issued an unmodified opinion and what that means
16:44 is that you had no material misstatements or uh findings through the audit process. Uh that was also the um
16:52 the opinion for the CRA as well. Uh because you are a government we also have to issue a government auditing standards report. Uh through that report
17:00 we have to indicate if there's any material weaknesses or sign significant deficiencies or any issues of non-compliance. Uh proud to say through
17:07 that report we had no issues of any of that.
17:14 So further we have more reports. If you receive more than a or if you expend more than a million dollars in uh
17:21 federal funding, you're required to have a single audit. And what that is is compliance testing on those federal funds and the expenditures on those
17:29 funds. U for state funding, it's a requirement to have a single audit if you have 750,000 in expenditures. This year you did have a single audit and
17:37 that was generated from expenditures through the ARPA funding. Uh so this is the last of the CO money. Uh it is officially all gone and all expended. Um
17:46 but that did create a single audit this year. Uh through that testing there was no non-compliance or no findings. Um and again I was just kind of reminding you of the the purpose of that testing.
17:56 Again it was just in a million or from a million dollars in expenditures through that program. Uh we also issue a management letter. So that's a Florida
18:03 statute requirement. Um and through that we indicate if there's any findings, any non-compliance issues as well. Um again,
18:10 we had no no findings. We had no recommendations or any other matters noted. Um we also issue a government
18:17 investment policies report. That's a Florida statute. You have to follow investment policies. Um and through that you you're required to issue a report on any compliance or findings through that.
18:27 There was no findings. Um everything was fine.
18:34 So, I do like to talk about significant accounting policies and I don't go into too much detail. Um, but for the ones that were implemented in the current
18:42 year, we did have Gazsby 101 and that is a compensated absence. Um, that is a new standard. Uh, through that standard,
18:48 you're now required to go through sort of a complicated process in determining an estimate for sick days that could be
18:55 potentially used during the year. And then of course you still have your liability that you record for any paid time off that you have to pay out to
19:03 people at the end. Um so through that process the finance department um worked through these calculations uh and determined the liability that had to be
19:11 recorded. Um but that is a government's that is a new standard that was implemented this year. We did not have to restate prior year balances uh
19:19 because it wasn't material in respect to that. Uh, Gazsby 102 was also a new standard for risk disclosures that
19:26 didn't impact the city at all. Um, some upcoming accounting standards, um,
19:31 Gazsby 103, this is a financial reporting model improvement standard.
19:35 Basically, it's going to improve the management discussion and analysis narrative. Uh, they're going to require more specifics on that um to really kind
19:43 of detail the variances between prior year and and the current year uh budget variances um from actual numbers. And then there's going to be some other
19:51 presentation changes on your enterprise fund statements, but it's really going to be all presentation uh changes and purposes for that. Gazsby 104 is also
19:59 going to be implemented uh coming in the next year. Um this is disclosure of certain capital assets. And again, this is just all going to be presentationbased.
20:16 So other communications um that I just like to note and we we communicate this with management as well. Uh your accounting estimates which are also
20:23 noted in the financial statements. Uh those really relate to receivables allowance. You have to do an allowance on receivables for those um that you might not consider to be collectible. Uh
20:32 you have a fair value of investment which that is always an estimate. um you have acrruels for the pension plan and the oped and then you also have what a
20:40 new standard that was implemented a couple years ago which is the lease receivable and deferred inflows which is considered a right of use asset and in
20:47 your in terms for the city that relates to your cell tower leases. So you now have to record that fully based on a
20:54 present value um of an asset and liability where before you didn't record that at all. It was just all revenue based. Um so again that's that's
21:02 obviously an estimate. Uh we did not have any disagreements with management.
21:06 There were no consultations with other accountants and we didn't have any issues discussed prior to retention.
21:13 I did just want to note um in the financial statements itself, you do have a breakout of how your funds are allocated to different categories and I
21:21 just want to touch base on those categories in case you're unaware or if anybody has any questions on those. Um but you will see in on your um
21:29 governmentwide statements as a total that your assets are broken out by each of these categories. And so what those are is you have a non-spendable
21:36 category. Um that means those those assets or that amount those those dollars are not in spendable form. So that's prepaid or inventory type of
21:44 items. You can't just easily convert that to cash. Uh restricted is going to be those are restricted by external parties. So that's mainly going to be your granters like let's say the ARPA
21:53 funds. They those had to be um restricted for certain purposes.
21:57 Um and then if you receive grant for purposes of new infrastructure um CDBG your SRF funds a lot of those are
22:04 restricted for certain projects. Um you also have committed funds. Those committed funds are usually restricted
22:11 um by the board or the council. So those are usually like um just anything that you guys decide um you want to use those funds for a specific project or purpose.
22:23 You also have assigned funds. So, those assigned funds are not restricted in any means. Um, it's just something that the city determines they want to put aside and spend on on something else. Again,
22:33 that's not any kind of commitment or restriction for the purpose of that. But they're just assigned for whoops for this project. Uh, the rest of it then is
22:41 unassigned and that's u obviously available for any purpose.
22:48 So, that is the result of the audit for this year. Everything went smooth. Uh,
22:51 we didn't have any issues. So, does anybody have any questions?
22:57 Was there anything when you were performing the audit that you thought we should be paying closer attention to or that you were concerned about? Nope. Everything was good.
23:04 Anything that might bite us in the bottom down the road? No. Hopefully not. Okay, great. Wow.
23:13 Go. Th This was your first year doing our audit or second year? Okay. um
23:21 any assessment as from last year to this year and recommendations moving forward not not necessarily specific to numbers
23:28 but just process or procedures and and whatnot.
23:31 Uh so we give management some recommendations throughout the process if we find them if it it doesn't warrant a deficiency or anything like that but if we see something like oh you might
23:40 add this you know cross your tees and dot your eyes type of thing. Um we didn't have too much of that this year.
23:45 Last year we did there was transition obviously from the old auditor new auditor we had different um methodologies of doing things and then there were new standards that were that
23:53 needed to be implemented as well. So we did work with management in that um too.
23:57 So there was improvement in that all of that went smoothly this year. Um and again we you know we do give training materials and and uh information for the
24:05 new standards coming up too. uh we put on our own webinars. So I will be sending that uh to the finance department too so they're aware of the
24:13 detailed new standards that are coming out so they'll be able to implement that timely. Okay. Thank you.
24:20 Just want to say thank you. You're welcome. Anything else?
24:26 No. Well, they just I I guess I was surprised by such a quick report. Yeah,
24:33 it was on time this year for for a report, you know. I sat through one yesterday on another board,
24:38 I said, and it was like about almost hour long, you know, like, wow. So, I was a little surprised. But you said one or two things that really c kind of
24:45 caught my eye. Uh, Gatsby 101. You said you now you have to kind of estimate the number of sick leave hours you're going to be using.
24:53 You do. And it is a complicated process.
24:55 It's I mean, it's they went through this huge spreadsheet. you have to go buy employees an estimation of how much time has been used over the last couple
25:02 years. Do these reasonleness tests. It it's a complicated process. Um so and that's just based on what you in
25:11 layman's terms what you think you might use in the next year. And then of course so that's part of the liability and then the second part of the liability is what
25:19 you have to pay out at at the end of the year to employees. So your paytime off is still being recorded as normal. the new part of it really comes and there's
25:28 there other there's other nuances but I won't get into all that um because it didn't affect the city much but it really just comes into the the sick hours that you use that you don't get
25:36 paid out at the end but you now have to estimate the liability for that based on what you think people may use and so basically you're saying if I if I had
25:43 a 100 hours but I only I got to guesstimate out of that 100 hours how much they may use correct even though they yes
25:51 and they loved that new standard right okay well all All right. That's that's Well, I guess that caught my ear because
26:00 I know when I was working sick leave that sick leave always played in. They wanted more transparent. I mean,
26:05 Gazsby wanted more transparency in the amount that the the municipalities might have to actually pay out in cash. So,
26:12 they wanted that now to be more of an acrruel.
26:15 So, just trying to cramp down. Okay. All right. That opinion was not asked. Thank you. I appreciate it. Anyone else?
26:22 Any other question? just for staff, Mr.
26:25 Bor, maybe um could you just explain to the general public where they can find what there's the large report and
26:32 there's also the uh what is it the paffer uh report uh could you just let folks know where that is and where they
26:40 can find that information so if they want to dig deeper into the reports they can. Absolutely. Uh thanks for the question.
26:47 So there is a page dedicated to auditor reports that's available through the finance department pages of the city's website. Um just for awareness uh we
26:57 have three different types of reports listed on there. The two which are done by the independent auditor one being the city audit and then the second one being
27:03 the CRA specific audit. Um the PAFER uh acronym stands for popular annual financial report is a staff created
27:11 unodudited document. Uh we created that for the first time this year. uh that is attached to the agenda packet, but it's
27:19 also on that same web page with the uh other two uh official audit reports. What is that?
27:25 I was going to say, is it fair to say it's kind of like a crib notes version of the uh or condensed version of the audited reports?
27:33 Those are good adjectives. Uh user friendly. User friendly. Anything like that. Yeah. Yes, sir.
27:39 Okay. If if I may take a moment um uh if your if that answers your question,
27:44 Council Member Bain, if I could please take a moment. Um the finance department has received a lot of congratulatory
27:51 remarks and kudos in recent months and and here recently specific to this audit and uh welld deserved and very much
27:58 appreciated. Um, but I I wanted to take a moment to um make the council and the public at large aware of and acknowledge
28:08 the efforts of others outside the finance department in this process. Um to accomplish an audit, the completion of an audit in six months is a herculean
28:17 task and it's not just the efforts of the finance department. We rely on the efforts of uh independent actuaries to
28:26 provide some of the data that's included in the the reports. uh we rely on the efforts of the two pension boards, fire and police, uh for doing similar type
28:34 work and contributions to include in the disclosures to our audits as well as city staff from other departments in particular our procurement department uh
28:43 contribute heavily to the work we do. Um so thank you to all of those entities and um like I said I just wanted to make
28:50 the council aware of their contributions as well. Thank you.
28:55 Thank you. As I as I've said many time Mr. Scott. Um, thank you because you jumped in here and you was a little I know we was a little afraid a couple
29:04 years ago when you took over and and everything and where we was at and you you brought it a long ways and tremendous um amount of the work was
29:12 done by you and your team and everything. So we we appreciate everything you did as well. So thank you.
29:16 Appreciate it. Thank you also and even even kept me out of trouble when we were switching auditors and everything had me scared and so I thank you for all the
29:25 education you was giving me along the way things I had to do that I didn't realize was was involved and so you was very helpful with me too as well. Thank you.
29:35 All right. Uh next thing we have on the agenda is public comment. If you wish to address the council in person, please come to the microphone and state your
29:42 name and address. Once in person comments are concluded, we will move on to virtual comments. If you are participating online
29:51 uh on Microsoft Teams and wish to provide comments, please raise your hand and you will be called to on to unmute your microphone when you turn to speak.
30:02 If you are participating by phone, you will press star five on your phone to raise your hand and when called upon,
30:08 you will press star six to unmute your microphone. For all virtual participants, if you wish to comment on
30:16 other items on the agenda, please stay on the Microsoft Teams or on your phone and raise your hand when that item comes
30:22 up on the agenda. The this portion of the meeting is only for items that are not on the agenda. In the
30:29 interest of time and efficiency and ensuring that everyone wishes to address the council is given opportunity to do so, each speaker will be permitted three
30:37 minutes to address the council to avoid disruption of the meeting. Speakers should avoid inappropriate language,
30:43 personal attacks, and derogatory statements and direct their com comments to the city council. Everyone is requested to be respectful of each other even when we disagree.
30:53 Public comment is now open.
30:57 This is public comment. Anyone want to address anything that's not on the agenda may come to the microphone. Okay.
31:07 1552.
31:09 Good afternoon, mayor, members of the council. Paula Hoisington, 564 East Dninnesota Street. First, I want to
31:15 thank the city for the inaugural jazz festival and the staff that worked tirelessly to put on such an excellent presentation.
31:26 There were folks from all around Central Florida. I didn't meet not one person that did not say they did not enjoy it.
31:32 And please, please, please have it again. The weather was hot, but the music was good, the food was good. So, if you missed it, you missed a treat.
31:40 Please try to come out next year.
31:43 Um, this next issue that I'd like to bring before the council and the public, um,
31:49 it's kind of disturbing to me.
31:53 I received some information from someone who's a current sitting city manager
32:00 that they have been approached by a recruitment firm for the position of city manager for Clermont.
32:10 Mr. Ben Wagner, I hope you're not leaving.
32:14 And that stunned me because I was not aware that we were looking, seeking, thinking about getting a city manager.
32:23 This came from a legitimate firm called Lean Solutions Group who said
32:32 they were acting in a confidential manner on behalf of the city.
32:39 Now, if this is something that has someone has hijacked our information,
32:46 I'm concerned. Either way, if we're seeking a city manager and there's been no public discussion,
32:53 I'm concerned.
32:55 This person who is a current city manager was approached March 20th,
33:04 April 15th,
33:07 and April 16th providing additional me information with each inquiry
33:15 to see if they were interested in putting their name in the hat. And Clermont, Florida. Clermont,
33:23 Florida. Right here. Right here. right? This city, this county. Okay. Um, and that's disturbing to me.
33:31 And if this is not a legitimate search,
33:35 then every one of you should be concerned.
33:38 Yes. If it is something that has been done confidentially,
33:45 then I would request that if there was any type of payment solicitation
33:51 that that information be brought forth today because if it was paid with city funds, there's a record of something upstairs.
34:02 Whether it was not, I think it still deserves a thorough investigation.
34:08 I would hope that the city, if you give me a little bit more time, I would hope that the city would not enter into any backdoor agreements,
34:18 but this claims that it's been going on,
34:20 that this position has an anticipated date, six weeks, that they've been working on this for six weeks to put
34:29 together their plan. And this wasn't just a matter of pick up the phone and say, "Hey,
34:36 there's email traffic."
34:39 Could you tell me the name of that group again that you said?
34:42 Lean Lean Solutions Group and it was March 20th, April Lean Solutions March 20th, April 15th
34:50 and the third time providing additional information was April 16th, 2026.
34:59 2026. This is active 2026, not 16 months, 16 weeks ago when we brought on Mr. Vanwife.
35:07 2026. Thank you for bringing this.
35:10 So, I'm bringing this to your attention here during open comments. Um, again, if
35:16 it's false information, somebody's using our name to allege that we are seeking
35:24 a city manager, then that's something I feel that you all should be concerned with and should look into it. If it is
35:31 something that is actually going on and someone has gone beyond their scope of authority,
35:38 again, it concerns me.
35:41 Thank Thank you, Miss H. And uh here's um here's what I I want to do. I want to go ahead and let me go ahead and finish
35:49 public comment and I want to come back and address this in in a minute after we close public comments because I I would like to know more about this and have a
35:57 couple of question but I want to get through public comment as well. Okay. Is that all right? All right.
36:05 Wow. Oh, this is public comment. Anyone else in the public wish uh in the chamber wish to address anything that's not on agenda? Please come to your
36:12 microphone and state your name, address and have three minutes.
36:26 Why?
36:44 Good afternoon. My name is Kurt Shu. I'm retired military officer. I have a restricted address due to the work I did in the military. Um,
36:53 when I was in DC this past month, there was a lot of celebration getting ready for the 250th coming up here in July of this year. Um,
37:02 a lot of excitement in DC. the whole country. There is more merchandise you can buy out there than you can shake two sticks at. I want to thank the mayor, of
37:11 course, city council members, senior staff. Um,
37:16 but we're coming into May and for those who know about Memorial Day, it started out with Remembrance Day. And I don't
37:23 know a single combat vet, those I served with, those in the VFW post here that I once commanded about 10 years ago as a post commander, the district commander,
37:32 who doesn't have someone they know in either Iraq or Afghanistan or some war that they were there when they died. And
37:38 the debt of remembrance because it Memorial Day was once called Remembrance Day started after the Civil War. And the debt of remembrance is the promise we keep.
37:50 The promise we keep for the 1.3 million or so that died,
37:55 that shed every ounce of their blood for our freedom, for this great country.
38:02 The average age of Vietnam was about 20.
38:05 20 years old. If you were into the Vietnam War, my uncle fought in the Vietnam War. Um, and there was a disproportionality for those who served
38:14 and those who died based upon race and ethnicity because a lot of people that weren't little like me served in combat in Vietnam. And I grew up in a trailer
38:22 park then. I was living in a trailer park in in the 1970s. We lost our home in ' 69.
38:28 And I can tell you that in a trailer park, we know a whole bunch of people older brothers got killed in Vietnam.
38:33 and I was in high school when it ended in 75.
38:37 I would ask everybody that stood up a little bit ago, did the pledge of allegiance to this great nation to think about when we hit May, which is this
38:46 coming month and this week, that's remembrance. Before we get to the celebration, let's remember the price that was paid. God bless you all. God bless our country. Thank you.
38:56 Thank you.
39:00 This is public comment. Anyone in the chamber wish to address anything that's not on agenda, please come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
39:10 Anyone in the chamber want to address anything that's not on agenda? Seeing no one have anyone online?
39:17 No, this time we have no one online. So, I'm going close public comment, but uh as I said,
39:22 I'm going to come back to the uh item Miss Horsein bought up. Mr. I the only thing I found online is with the name
39:31 Lean Solutions Group is more of an AI technology company. It has nothing to do with management recruitment or anything like that. I've searched for the Lean Solutions Group in different spellings.
39:41 I've searched for city manager search for Clermont. Nothing's coming up.
39:47 Um this all coming up AI,
39:52 correct? It's an AI company that does it. It's out of um South Florida somewhere and they do all sorts of
39:59 technology and manufacturing stuff but nothing with city government or recruitment or anything like that.
40:06 However, we got a uh you said the sitting city manager correct that have received this received
40:15 miss hor come please
40:25 correct a current city a current sitting city manager that received the information and like I said if it's been
40:32 a spook on the city that someone some other whatever type of company is out there doing this pretending that it's Clermont, we should be concerned. Yeah,
40:43 we should try to get to the bottom of it. If it was done and you all nobody knows about it, either way, it is something that should be looked at because this person received multiple
40:52 inquiries. I mean with like information on what was required, what the salary will be, who you report to, information about the city of Clermont,
41:03 the whole the whole nine yards. Mr. W did, how do you spell lean?
41:07 Well, I'll I can jump in. Lean Solutions Group does do recruiting. Okay. So, you found something on them. Okay.
41:15 Does anybody on this DAS know anything about what she's talking about? Because I do not.
41:19 No. No. That's why I guess I I wanted to get into this because that that's some serious that's serious. Uh we got someone out here um hiring first of all,
41:30 how do they hire hire um a company without it come coming through the council be my first question. Bingo.
41:36 Okay. Um all that kind of hiring and have have to come through council that have to go through procurement for us to vet the company and everything else
41:45 before we hire a company. And I don't recall anything coming through here. Uh last I heard was when we was talking about doing a city manager what a year and a half almost two years ago for Mr.
41:56 Van Wagner which I could have it that wasn't lean I don't what was it lean solution solution. Yeah I don't think they even made the list of
42:04 companies we were looking at. I don't I don't recall that name. So um well we live in a world where you can't trust what you see on the television let
42:12 alone what comes on email. I mean, it concerns me in the sense of like, is this a is this a spook? Use your word.
42:22 But I feel I want to tell you and anyone else listening, I'm a licensed member of the Florida Bar and veracity is a serious issue. I will not lie.
42:31 Um, sometimes to my detriment. I know nothing about this and I'm very I would like it if anyone on this dis does know
42:40 anything about this if that was disclosed because if we don't know anything about this then this this is a
42:48 serious thing for the public to be aware of that something could come across but given the history of this dis and in the
42:57 in the on the subject of transparency I'm affirmatively stating to each one of you and the public. I don't know anything about this.
43:05 I know nothing about it myself. But however, is the your source reliable? I guess is our next question.
43:13 City manager.
43:14 They are a sitting city manager. If they're sitting city manager and wanted to know what would it be like working for Clermont?
43:22 Well, can we So,
43:24 so you're saying I'm sorry manager came to you.
43:27 I'm sorry, Mr. Peterson. I was speaking Hold on, Miss Peterson. make any it kind of doesn't make it's kind of like misinformation that's being Hold on, Mr. Peterson. Hold on.
43:35 Well, and that's what I'm asking. So, I I think we kind of be we we kind of openly ended it asked it out
43:42 there. So, can we just ask the city manager or the city attorney, the deputy city manager, procurement director,
43:48 whomever would would be involved in a process like this, do you have any knowledge of a recruitment effort being
43:58 done on behalf of the city of Clermont for a city manager? I can tell you as the acting city manager, I am this was the first time I've ever heard this,
44:07 okay, when Miss Paula mentioned it and I have no intention of stepping down until the majority of you asked me to. Okay,
44:15 so I'm here. I'm not leaving and I have no clue, but I will get with Mr. Boore and we will check out Lean Solutions
44:24 Group and make sure there's no compensation that's been given to them from the city. But Mr. Bain, I I am totally 100% unaware of this. I'm my sh
44:33 my face is probably in shock right now because I've never heard of Yeah.
44:36 something this far down the road just three convers this is very troubling.
44:42 Yeah. Well, and that's why I want to I I think we need to be clear if like if if no one up I I want to give everybody the opportunity directly to answer it
44:49 because if that is not the case, then I I would as a council member want to authorize the city to take whatever
44:57 steps and means necessary to defend the city and to quash this both legally and
45:06 um ethically, whatever we can do to to shut it down to shut it down. And so uh I I guess uh c can I city attorney or
45:14 the deputy city manager if there's again any any other knowledge related to a city manager search that is aware that
45:22 you're aware of or you've approved or been involved with Mr. Mr. Van Wagner not just uh Scott Boore but I think you need to get the chief involved in this.
45:31 Sure.
45:31 Okay. All right. Yeah. And Mr. walk city attorney yet because I have no knowledge of it and everybody up here on this on
45:39 this das is saying they have no knowledge of it. I think we it well everybody hasn't said that. Uh oh. I'm sorry.
45:45 So I I I'm a person I like to hear. Do you know about it? No. Do you know anything about it?
45:54 No. Mr. Matthysse? No. Mr. Peterson? No. Miss Myers? No. Mayor Murry? No. Mr. Bain?
46:02 No. Okay. So unanimous. Okay.
46:05 Is that health? That's all better. I would have wanted to hear that if I can we ask the city attorney then. Better. Yes.
46:10 What what would what would we what can we do in a situation like this that that there's an entity out there representing
46:17 fake or not? Yeah. You've researched the organization apparently exists. What can we do?
46:23 Well, I think the the first thing it's like when you have identity fraud. I presume that if this is the organization that actually is engaged in some kind of
46:32 search, then they've done so with false authority and so we need to find out who what the basis for the authority is as fast as possible.
46:40 So they were told it was a confidential search.
46:43 It was a confidential search. So the confidence was broke when it was brought to me. Well,
46:51 now it's just wanted your opinion. That's all. That ship has sailed. Well, I mean,
46:58 but but obviously no such search could happen or have any proper authority without coming to you,
47:05 the city council. Period.
47:07 Um, and that to the best of my record or knowledge, that's never happened.
47:12 Well, name of the uh she's the city.
47:15 No, I am not going to give you the name of the city manager.
47:19 How can we I am not going to give you the name of the city manager. I gave you the name of the company. Yeah,
47:25 that is soliciting this person. But I am not going to give you the name of the city manager.
47:30 There are other open city manager or recent not that far away. And I my first thought was is there some kind of crazy
47:39 miscommunication or something. But you seem pretty firm.
47:42 Yeah. So yeah, because I call in cuz I know I live in Clermont. Yeah.
47:45 So I think we're looking for uh a direction if it needs to be an emotion.
47:49 Mr. vein if you if I'm stepping on your toes. Please tell me to stop to one authorize our attorney to contact
47:57 Lean Solutions and find out on what authority if verify that this wasn't a mistake and if they believe they're
48:04 actively seeking direction from the city. Why do they think that and to issue a cease and desist at this point?
48:11 Well, I would ask that you not direct me to do necessarily cease and desist. I don't I want to find out what the truth is.
48:18 Yeah. Fact find we have to find out what's what's going on before we look at any actions they're taking. Right. Somebody may be using their name.
48:27 Yeah. Let me rattle a cage or two. Yes. Okay. Please.
48:31 Do you have an idea as to how long that would take and how we can get that information back to us just given the the the seriousness of it in terms of I kind of look at it as identity theft in that regard.
48:41 It's going to start uh momentarily. Okay.
48:44 And and I I I don't know how long it'll take. It could be during the meeting,
48:49 could be after, I don't know, but I I know what I'm going to do. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, sir. And thank you.
48:54 And thank you, Miss Hington, for bringing this to us. Well, that was an interesting start.
49:03 Wow.
49:08 Identity theft on the city. A Okay. All right. Before we move on any further, uh,
49:18 Mr. Van White, do we have any changes to the agenda? Not that I'm aware of.
49:26 Wow. Wow. Okay. All righty.
49:32 All righty. In that case, we going to move on to the next portion of the meeting for the consent item, consent agenda, which contain items that have been determined to be routine and
49:40 non-controversial. If anyone in the audience wish to address a particular item on the consent agenda, now is the opportunity for you to do so.
49:48 Additionally, if staff or members of the city council wish to speak on a consent item, they have the same opportunity.
49:55 The consent item for tonight is item one through nine. So, is there anyone any item one through nine need to be pulled for separate discussion?
50:07 I'll do it the right way. I'll come to the microphone instead of yelling out from the seats. Yes, sir.
50:11 I'd like to have item number two, the Eastman request pulled. Okay.
50:18 Any other any other items?
50:26 No one online want any item we'll pull.
50:28 Right. Okay. Seeing no one none other items, we'll entertain a motion on items one and three through nine.
50:36 I move to accept items one and three through nine. Second.
50:43 I have a motion and a second for uh accepting of agenda item of consent agenda items one and item 3 through nine as presented. No further discussion.
50:52 Uh Mr.
50:54 Just with regard to number four, just for the uh for knowledge for the public,
50:58 we're writing off about $183,000 in um in bad debt for uh business taxes
51:06 that were not paid. Um I asked the the finance director for a list of that.
51:10 It's 44 pages of businesses that haven't paid past business taxes going back to
51:18 2006. Um, and so, um, I just want to to this is an accounting thing for us to be
51:26 able to to to write it off, but it's my understanding and I just want to get confirmation before we vote that the city uh the city will still use any
51:35 reasonable efforts to continue to try to collect these bad debts. Um, because we know that uh if these were homeowners
51:43 and property taxes, uh, there would be uh quite a bit of ramification for that.
51:48 And I think we need to hold our our businesses to that same standard.
51:52 Well, M uh Mr. Bain uh Mr. War, since we no long we we eliminated business tax receipt, is there any need to go back and try to continue to collect these?
52:03 So, if we don't no longer collect business tax receipt,
52:05 we have discussed this uh with staff in the background and it's a policy decision. It's a policy decision. So,
52:11 the answer to your question is it depends on what you think. Okay. Um so either the city engages in some kind of
52:18 write off um in which it gets moved from one part of the books to the other or we actually go and collect and the
52:26 recommended action has been to not spend time, effort and money on collection. So that's what the recommendation is to you.
52:34 Well, I'm assuming well the question I asked because we're writing this off is because we cancel business tax receipts.
52:41 Oh, that's exactly right. That's why we decided to do the write off. Okay.
52:44 Yeah. And I and I understand that and I certainly any we did that effective.
52:48 What was the actual date of effective of that? Was that 20 a year ago? A year ago.
52:54 Okay. So, but I mean we're talking 2006 7 18. Uh it's practically every year is represented. Uh they they were on the
53:03 books at that time. Um, and I just certainly think that, you know, uh, if they're going to be good stewards and good community members, they should they should pay what they owe at that time,
53:12 regardless of how we fel feel about it now moving forward because policies do change as my understanding is that some of those
53:20 business aren't even in business anymore.
53:21 Yeah, that's the thing. If it's not Yeah. If they're not in business,
53:24 obviously there's nothing we can do. But look at the list. There are several that a lot of us patron uh, daily.
53:31 Legally, we can collect. I mean um but we we have tried to factor in all of those things that you just mentioned.
53:37 Yeah. Well, it's my understanding as Miss Myers said, majority of them is no longer in business. As you say, they go back to 2006. So, most like most of
53:45 them. So, we may spend more money trying to collect than we we actually collect.
53:50 So, I I just my recommend Well, I suggest we just go ahead and write it all down. I'm not voting against.
53:56 Okay. Okay. All right. Just for the hope the public understand, but Okay. Um again I have a motion and a second for
54:04 approval of items one consent item one and item 3 through nine as presented. Any further discussion? No sir.
54:12 All in favor let it be known by saying I. I. All oppose and chair vote I as well.
54:18 Motion passes 5. Uh item number two. Yes sir.
54:26 Good evening city council Vincent near Regency Hills. I'm just uh when I was reading this, I was a little concerned
54:33 about this. Uh if I could have somebody pull up the original that's in your packet. It seems like I can't. For some
54:41 reason, the internet in this room is horrible. I had it before. If you if you could look at it and just stop me if I'm going off target on it. It says that we have to move the utilities. Now, see,
54:54 this is the problem. I've been fighting this for day one to get this expansion going along. Okay? And they finally, the brainiacs finally came up with an idea.
55:03 And that's a bad I shouldn't call them names. Uh they came up with an idea to take a $12 million loan. And I'm just a little concerned when I read it saying that we have to give up Eastman's. Okay.
55:15 I would like to know who's paying for this. Is the city of Clermont paying for it? Cuz they they're the ones that took out the $12 million. They knew about this problem in 2007.
55:26 So technically they knew Hartwood Marsh would be a four-lane road. So my question is why would you allow us to build our utilities when you know we
55:35 would have to move them? Once again that's waste of money especially the clammonts. All right. So I I would like to have those answers so this way it's
55:44 on record and I could go to the county and complain about it if I have to. All right. Cuz I don't have a problem. All
55:52 right. complaining that they're spending Clermont's money when this is your problem to start with. Okay. So,
55:58 somebody could justify why we're moving the utilities. I No,
56:03 not justify because I know we have to expand the road. All right. We're all for that. All right. There was just a big article how Clermont is a black eye
56:12 for the biggest congestion. I just read it the other day and we need this. But don't hold us, my point is don't hold the city of Clermont hostage.
56:23 saying, "We're not going to do this."
56:24 All right. Now, I remember the council stating that we're not paying for certain utilities. Does that have to do
56:31 with this? Because I mean, if you guys passed it without us knowing if we're paying for it, I think the public would get upset.
56:39 Well, uh, Kurt,
56:43 probably is here.
56:45 Oh, okay. Miss Mayor, where are the I didn't see I'm sorry. I didn't see him sitting back there. Thank you. Oh,
56:52 that's Yeah, I think it might benefit any public who wants to speak to hear what Mr. Mayworm says about this so they can decide if they should come.
57:01 It's pretty much standard. It's our It's our utility.
57:06 Uh Jim Mayworm, assistant director of public services. Um,
57:10 short answer to the question, uh, the utilities were in place, and I really don't know the history of this, but we
57:18 have citywide utilities in county right away all over the place. The agreement,
57:26 the permit that we get from the county states that should anything ever happen, it's on us to move the utilities. So,
57:36 this is that case where we are obliged and obligated to move the utilities.
57:41 Obviously, it's to our city's best interest to do that because we all want the road to expand. We've budgeted the money for it. We've known about it for a
57:50 few years. We've had plans designed for this and we're taking the utilities out of the right of way and moving them into
57:59 a specific easement that we've negotiated with LAR Corporation, believe it or not. Um, right along the edge of
58:06 Kings Ridge. So, I mean, that's that's really the story behind it. Is it fair?
58:13 I you know, that's just a different question. The same application occurs to
58:20 any utilities, Duke Energy, uh, Spectrum Cable, you name it. They're obliged if
58:28 they put it in the county right away to move it whenever the county says, "I'm expanding the road."
58:36 We potentially will have a similar situation if the county ever does something to Hancock.
58:41 Oh boy. Let's not even talk about Hancock as an example. That's That's what we're looking at. So So that's what this is, right? This is
58:49 on Oh, this is Heartwood Marsh. This is This is Hartwood My This This This one's somewhat simple compared to what Hancock going to be.
58:58 We will have this situation with Hancock. Oh, yeah. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So,
59:03 so can you explain for the public in case someone wants to comment why why a prior administration would put the
59:12 utilities in what is obviously an expansion right away most likely at the time and and again
59:20 this the history significantly predates me so I'm I'm just speaking from past experience you know
59:28 perhaps expansion wasn't contemplated at the time when the utilities were put in andor permitted and then of course
59:36 something over time quickly changed from year to year situations can change. Um either that or that location was thought
59:45 to be the quickest, easiest and least expensive for the city to do and we took
59:52 the path of least resistance just to get these things completed and then down the road you end up paying a higher price unfortunately. Well,
1:00:02 that's but you anticipated this and have the money already set aside. Absolutely. Yes, we've seen this coming.
1:00:09 Yeah. And and normally these things happen. Same thing. I look at Highway 50 over here as we come down through uh Highway uh Climop.
1:00:18 The people that plan and put the building right next to the road had no intention or had no vision that we were going to have to expand someday. Okay?
1:00:26 And that's basically what happened. And then we talk I say I don't want to talk about Hancock because guess what? A lot of your utilities is actually under the road.
1:00:34 Yeah.
1:00:35 So So whenever they do anything out there that's going to be a a real serious problem open to the public before um
1:00:42 Well, also keep in mind that that same standard applies to our own roads. So should we want to realign, I don't know,
1:00:52 say blocks them to solve a little intersection problems, who's ever put their electric poles in our in our right
1:01:00 of way is going to be obliged to move them out of our right of way at their cost.
1:01:05 So I mean it's just sort of the way business is done.
1:01:09 Some some of the things we just have to try to compensate for for previous decision that were made years ago and
1:01:16 everything. So, um, and that's why when we talk about East Avenue, redoing East Avenue, that's a big concern because we have a lot of utilities underneath the
1:01:24 road there and and we I keep saying we need to do East Avenue, but we need to update the utility this year.
1:01:31 I know we're going to resurface, but we still need to look at the uh utility because I think we just had a big issue over there yesterday as well. So, yes,
1:01:38 but this is a public comment. Yes, this is uh public and anyone in the public wish to address society may come to the microphone and state your name and address. If I may follow up, your honor,
1:01:47 I just would like to know because I saw the map that was in the packet and I would like to know how many utilities
1:01:54 we're talking about. Is it the north side or this? Cuz I can't find I don't know. I don't know what's underground,
1:02:01 but what I see is a water station by Kings Ridge. Is that the only Eastman
1:02:08 we're talking I mean the other utilities we're talking about? cuz I know the telephone poles aren't our problem. The
1:02:16 traffic light on the corner of Hancock and what that's that's Lake County. I just want to know what belongs to us. Well,
1:02:22 I mean, we do have the money for it, but if we don't have to spend the money, we could spend it on something else that's important. That's all I'm I'm being cheap. What could I tell you?
1:02:31 Well, we going to have to spend the money because nobody else going to come in there and move our utility. We have to do that. I understand what you're saying. What all we got there? I think
1:02:39 we well most of the utility for everybody is running along that same thing and everybody responsible for the edge company responsible for their own.
1:02:46 I think we got some water lines running down through there. I don't know if we got any uh optical running down through there. I don't know what's all running down there.
1:02:53 All right. Thank you. Thank you.
1:02:56 Some of everything is running down there because everything is put in the same easement. Everybody in the same small planning. Yeah.
1:03:02 But this is a public com uh form. Anyone in the public wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:03:10 Anyone in the chamber want to address this item may come to the microphone,
1:03:13 state your name and address and have three minutes. Seeing no one, anyone online? No one online. I hold public com public comment and come back to council.
1:03:21 What say council?
1:03:22 Okay. It's my understanding that this isn't really a vote that it's already done. It's a done deal. I mean, we have to move the uh utilities. It's not a
1:03:31 question of, you know, can we say no, we don't want to do it or can you say Lake County, you pay for it. No, they it's going to be our responsibility to move
1:03:39 it. So, I mean, we can have a discussion as to is this a right or wrong thing, but it's it's it's a done deal already.
1:03:45 So, we can, you know, we can discuss it,
1:03:48 but I don't think it we have any any room for uh wavering, but for for a positive response to it,
1:03:55 like I say, this is pretty much standard. Okay, this is standard standard the way things go. And years ago when they was planning hard with Marsh Road, they had no idea it was
1:04:04 going to need expanding and they put the ement there. Uh we run into these kind of problems all the time. So u and with that, I'd like to make a motion
1:04:11 then to approve item number two. Item number two. Mhm. I second.
1:04:18 Have a motion and a second for approval of item number two on the uh consent agenda. Any further discussion?
1:04:25 Hearing none. All in favor, let it be known by saying I. I. All oppose. Chair vote eyes. Well, motion passes.
1:04:32 50. All righty. Item number 10, ordinance number 2026-011.
1:04:38 Final. This was tabled from uh week two weeks ago.
1:04:43 An ordinance of the city council of the city of Clermont, Florida, amending ordinance
1:04:50 2022 just 018 to contract the boundaries of the Wellness Ridge Community Development District located within the
1:04:58 city of Clermont, Florida. describing the boundaries of the land to be removed from the Wellness Ridge Community Development District and describing the
1:05:07 new external boundary of the Wellness Ridge Community Development District after contraction. Providing for all other conditions to to remain unchanged,
1:05:17 providing for severability and repeal.
1:05:19 Providing for administrative correction of Scrivener's error, providing for an effective date, and providing for recording.
1:05:28 Yes, sir. Good afternoon, mayor, city council members, and guests. John Cruz,
1:05:33 Development Services. Um, the petitioner, the Wellness Ridge Community Development District, is requesting to
1:05:40 amend the current CDD ordinance 2022-08 con to contract the boundary of the district by 0.08 acres.
1:05:50 This revised request has been made by the petitioner omitting the original request to add property property known
1:05:57 as sanctuary wellness ridge. The current boundary includes 574.01 acres of land within the district which
1:06:06 is known as the Wellness Ridge development. The contraction includes a small portion of the neighborhood non-residential center that should not
1:06:13 be subject to the CDD. The small contraction parcel has no home sites on it and no infrastructure in the
1:06:20 district. The removal of this would have no impact or effect on the current homeowners in the district. The request would decrease the boundary district to
1:06:29 approximately 573.93 acres.
1:06:33 As part of the review, city staff requested one condition be placed into the ordinance. It is under section five board turnover. This condition has been
1:06:42 added to protect the current lot owners from extending the time period of the turnover of the CDD.
1:06:48 The create the creation of the CDD is governed under chapter 190 of the Florida statutes. Within Lake County,
1:06:55 there are close to 60 CDDs in existence of which four are in the city of Clermont. The original CDD was
1:07:02 presented and approved by city council on May 10th, 2022 for the Wellness Ridge property.
1:07:09 The city council's role is to hear the petition and vote to either approve or deny the requested contraction of the boundary of the Wellness Ridge CDD. The
1:07:18 city received objection emails from some of the property owners for the original expansion and contraction petition.
1:07:24 However, no objections have been received for the contraction only. This agenda item was tabled at the April 14th
1:07:31 meeting to allow the petitioner to amend their request and remove the expansion portion of the CDD boundary. Staffer recommends approval of Ordinance
1:07:40 2026-011 subject to condition outlined under section five board turnover which is
1:07:47 page 325 in your packet. That concludes staff's presentation. Thank you. This is a public hearing.
1:07:55 Anyone Oh, I'm sorry. Is the applicant present? Um,
1:08:04 trying to get Hi, Jan Carpenter, council for the
1:08:13 Wellness Ridge CDD, 2011 North Orange Avenue, Orlando, Florida. And as you know, we were before you with the
1:08:21 addition and the expansion to add Wellness Ridge. with the concerns that we had heard, we thought it best to just do the contraction, which is less than a
1:08:28 tenth of an acre, and it goes along a roadway. Um, and it was a surveying error. Once the road was built correctly, then that portion should not
1:08:36 have been in the CDD. So, this is just clearing up an administrative issue on our end. There'll be no impact on budgets, infrastructure, or anything else. No impact on residents by this.
1:08:46 Okay. Thank you. Thank you, ma'am. We have any questions? We will call you back at a later time.
1:08:51 But this is a public hearing. Anyone in the public wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:09:14 Joe Famasi 2693 jumping jack way.
1:09:19 I appreciate they amended the petition to stop the expansion, but I'm here today to ask you to deny the whole petition.
1:09:28 The CDD government is not acting as an independent government, but as a shell company for LAR. I've just submitted
1:09:35 documents from the petition for the expansion showing that in the share drive, those came from LAR,
1:09:43 not from the CDD.
1:09:45 Also, the figures came from the developer.
1:09:50 My problem today as it stands is that CDD is supposed to provide services for the residents and that's not currently happening.
1:10:00 Yesterday, the city manager's office and department of building I'd like to thank for coming out and reviewing the work
1:10:09 that is being done by the developer which should have been assured by the CDD independent government.
1:10:16 We have two phase 1 A phase 1 B. They should have been done 2024. These were turned over to the CDD. Currently, they
1:10:25 still cannot meet city inspections to be turned over to the city. So, my question is, I need remedies from you. The best
1:10:34 thing you could do is to deny this petition today and withhold any plot furtherance until the CDD government
1:10:41 makes sure the developer meets the needs of the residents, the people they're supposed to serve.
1:10:47 I have major concerns and I'm asking for your help today. Please read your recent city reports.
1:10:54 For the third time, phase 1A, which was turned over to CDD because they said that it was completed, is going the the road has to be tore up again.
1:11:05 Thank goodness that the city notified us that this was going to happen. This is for the third time that this road's had
1:11:12 to repaved because it's not meeting city standards. So my question is the CDD and the engineer, how are they calling this complete?
1:11:23 Please deny this petition today. Send a strong message. Represent the people you're supposed to represent and do the
1:11:30 job that you're supposed to do. Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else? This is a public hearing.
1:11:39 Anyone else?
1:11:41 Anyone else in the chamber wish to address it? may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes. Seeing no one else, uh,
1:11:48 Mr. Wing, do I have anyone online? No one online. I'm a close public comment. Uh, Mr. War or Mr.
1:11:56 Whatever. I think only thing we're addressing not the whole CDD. We We've already That's already been approved, right? The CDD has been approved.
1:12:04 Had been approved. So, what we're addressing here today is just that one little little piece.
1:12:09 Correct. Um, and my understanding that one little piece is going to lower well don't understand why it was there anyway, but it's not going to change the
1:12:16 amount of money they ch in the uh CDD or anything else.
1:12:20 I I think it's should have trivial or immaterial effect to those things for the CDD is my understanding.
1:12:27 So, if we want to if they we want to take a look at uh getting rid of the whole CDD, are we can we do that today? Uh,
1:12:35 no.
1:12:36 No, I didn't think so. That's I guess that's my question and everything as the request was because we only acted on that one little sliver there and
1:12:44 everything which I mean unless district council disagrees with me. No, I don't think that the city can eradicate the CDD. Okay.
1:12:50 But then what is the purpose of this little So if we deny this, what does that mean? What does that do?
1:12:57 Well, it means that you haven't taken action on the petition in front of you,
1:13:00 but this is a hearing regarding a very very minor contraction. It's it's just a little small small piece in there that they taken out.
1:13:08 The point I'm making is why are we even entertaining this for a little tiny small piece? Why is it an item on the agenda as opposed to you know that the
1:13:18 the other one was when they were going to do at Sanctuary Ridge in now they're not, you know, and I understand because we have some people in the community
1:13:25 that are vocal that are knowledgeable that brought that information to you and my understanding is that's why you removed it. But why do you have this
1:13:32 little 0.1 acre piece that's added in for no reason whatsoever?
1:13:37 Unfortunately, it's required by Florida statutes legally to take a small piece out of a CDD. We have to go through the petition process.
1:13:44 But if my question but I don't understand why you want to remove the small piece because it's not necessary for the CDD and should belong to the parcel that's next to it.
1:13:53 It was a surveying error when they first laid out and the parcels were not laid out.
1:13:57 So does the surveying error then void the whole CDD then? Can can I step to that? Hold on. Yes, go ahead. Your name, please. Yeah. So, Lane Register, Lenar Holmes.
1:14:06 Um, so yes, I I do have a good bit of context on this. So, let me maybe clarify just a little something here.
1:14:12 So, first of all, that that that sliver of property that you're looking at on the screen, the Hatchot area is not owned by any LAR entity, anybody that's
1:14:19 a resident of the CDD that's owned by South Lake Crossing. Um, it was inadvertently included. I shouldn't even say inadvertently included. You can see
1:14:28 kind of kind of squint. It's not a, you know, great representation, but you can see essentially where a turn lane was added. Um, you can kind of see how the
1:14:37 right turn lane that's going to turn north. Is that Are you following me there?
1:14:41 Okay. So, that turn lane was added to the geometry.
1:14:45 So, kind of timing here, you got to work with me. The CDD was established prior to wellness way segment B geometry being
1:14:53 completely finalized and like everybody having blessed it the the city the county and it actually you know the the rightway being dedicated. So to that
1:15:02 end, that sliver piece was incorrectly included um kind of upfront in the uh establishment was correct at the time.
1:15:12 But once the geometry of wellness waist segment B was set, then it essentially became, you know, an error, an
1:15:20 unfortuned error here, uh that should not have been included in CD. It's not the owner of that property is not part of the CDD. They own that property.
1:15:30 they're not um entitled to any of the you know rights of the CDD. Uh so I mean that's it's simply a cleanup and this is
1:15:37 the legal method by which we do it. So um you know denying this does not hurt
1:15:44 Lenar to be clear. It would be detrimental to that property owner. So,
1:15:50 um, you know, I I just want to be clear that if the intention is to, you know,
1:15:56 um, you know, have any kind of teeth with LAR, that's not it.
1:16:01 So, is the property owner the V3 Capital Jimmy Carr property? So, this is Yeah.
1:16:07 Completely unrelated to your organization.
1:16:09 So, we we are just facilitating this cleanup because this was, you know, we were responsible for the the design and I'm saying we very generously here. Um
1:16:18 but you know uh Lar was the kind of uh leader of the design out here through our consultants right
1:16:25 and so to clean this up for Mr. Carr and for his investor group we are facilitating the uh 3,400 something square foot contraction in the CB.
1:16:35 So in in simple terms I guess for me in simple terms basically we giving them a piece of their property back that we took by mistake but it's going
1:16:44 we didn't exactly take it. It's just a a small portion of it is included because what I look at it's all part of wellness way there and everything which
1:16:52 is that shouldn't be it wouldn't be taken care of under this uh CDD it should be under the MSTU for wellness way and everything
1:17:00 well but looking at it differently council please correct me if I'm wrong is this hashed area is actually in the
1:17:10 road called wellness way which means there's it's in the rightway of the road.
1:17:15 No, the rightway the the southern I'm going to call it the southern boundary of that hatched area is the northern boundary of the rightway. Mhm.
1:17:23 Oh, the rightway itself. Yes.
1:17:25 Yeah. But it's is it'll be a part of the Wellness Way uh MSTU for his landscaping and all that because it run.
1:17:34 I'm under pressure.
1:17:35 The the MSTU would just uh be responsible for the landscaping the rightway. So technically speaking, I
1:17:42 mean that parcel that parcel my understanding is that I'm speaking a little bit out of turn here. I'm not the
1:17:50 expert on this, but I am fairly confident that you could, you know, pull up the tax records and determine that those uh commercial
1:17:58 parals are subject to the MSTU assessments. Okay.
1:18:01 What agency manages the storm water on the north side of the car V3 property there? It's kind of in a peak ju uh
1:18:11 immediately to the east of the HO in Scoffield Road.
1:18:14 Uh you're talking about um yeah, just to the east of the HO is um sorry, when
1:18:22 you're talking about a peak, I see a peak to the west of the HO.
1:18:25 To the east, there's a slight kind of point where there's a storm water.
1:18:30 I think that's all that that is part of the commercial parcel. That is their wholly contained storm water system. So,
1:18:35 it's my understanding that the purpose of the CDD um is to manage the storm water for this region and obviously we're in the Lake Wells Ridge. No, I'm
1:18:44 getting a no. What What does the CDD do in this to to be clear for it manages the CDD manages the stormwater system within the
1:18:52 boundary of the CDD? That storm water that particular stormwater pond which I that's an older concept plan. I can't even tell you if that stormwater pond is
1:19:00 there um or is designed to be there today. For sure. that one on the other side of the road is and that is that is
1:19:08 all part of the SLC holdings like that's all of their storm water system is wholly unrelated to to our I'm going to
1:19:16 say our stormwater system the CDDs correct is there any connection at all between the storm water system within the
1:19:23 boundaries of the CDD and the properties on any side it's water so we
1:19:30 I I mean I I'd have to defer to our engineer who's not here So, that's not something I'd be comfortable answering.
1:19:36 Question. Do we have It's strange. Um, that's it's not or there. I do not know. We don't know.
1:19:41 Yeah. I mean, it's it's all part of the water management district permit. So, I can tell you that.
1:19:46 As I spoke a few council meetings ago, I had sent a letter uh email to Mr. Van Wagner and everything asking for them to
1:19:53 spell out everybody's responsibility down there. And a month or so ago, few weeks ago, you should have gotten a respon uh response back from uh Kirk and
1:20:02 Mr. war explaining exactly what the CDD supposed to be responsible for, what the MSTU supposed to be fun, what the HOA,
1:20:09 all the areas of responsibility because it is very confusing down there and that's why I asked for that a few months ago and everything but uh if I'm not
1:20:16 mistaken he they finished it up somewhat and sent it out should have sent it out.
1:20:20 I don't know if you saw it but uh if you take a look at that it'll spell out the CDD responsibility MSTU responsibility
1:20:28 how much all all this budgets and all this. Well, and my question relates more to the interaction between the storm water system within the CDD. And when
1:20:37 this was originally brought to us, it was because the sanctuary parcel has a storm water system that connects to the
1:20:44 Wellness Way CDD. And so what I'm what I just want to make sure I I think for purposes of today when we're dealing
1:20:51 with this strip of land, I I spent 10 years dealing with random strips of land in Lake County and I understand the need to clean it up. I'm just and for today
1:21:00 we're not dealing with sanctuary so it's not before us but I just think for all of us to be aware that there is a connectivity between these storm water
1:21:08 systems and we are in the lake whales ridge and we do affect the Florida aquifer and we do need to be responsible with how we're
1:21:15 managing this storm water system. So having St. John's involved is good. I'm going to be okay moving forward with this particular ask today, but I
1:21:23 continue to be concerned with the overall um health of the environmental ridge itself. And so I do want to make
1:21:32 sure that we're not letting uh I want to make sure that we're being good neighbors to one another and that we're getting along as neighbors to take care
1:21:39 of the land that we've been entrusted with. And um for today, I don't have a problem with this ask,
1:21:46 but I do want to be mindful of the big picture as we move forward. Yep.
1:21:51 And I will just kind of u you know jump a few meetings ahead. Sorry about that.
1:21:57 Uh I'll jump a few meetings ahead uh at some point. I'm saying a few meetings.
1:22:00 It it it's going to have to go through staff, but we will be sub submitting a separate petition for a separate CDD for
1:22:08 sanctuary. However, um that petition will be accompanied with a draft of an interlocal agreement between the two
1:22:15 districts to require cooperation for that very purpose.
1:22:19 So that that's uh you know really one of the biggest concerns that that we have is um in the future that not being in place. Yeah. So,
1:22:28 and uh and Miss M. Strange, I understand concern that sanctuary CDD that he's speaking of. I think that has four four
1:22:37 retention ponds. And I can say uh if you look at the email that Kurt sent out, it should be a map in there showing you is
1:22:45 um if there's any retention ponds, all that'll be showing on that map and everything. They put he they put together a pretty good package for us.
1:22:52 and finally got to go and you look at it, it'll show it all out where um all the roads and landscape and everything,
1:22:58 the CDD and the retention pond this that this CDD is already responsible for. But um I'm glad to hear that one of the things I just heard was glad to hear
1:23:06 that you're going to come back for a separate CDD on on the sanctuary. Absolutely.
1:23:10 Actually, the people in the sanctuary are going to benefit out of that. So, yes.
1:23:16 Thank you, Mayor. Um Mr. for a while just to kind of make it maybe in some easier terms to digest.
1:23:24 Currently,
1:23:26 this 008 acre strip if if anything needs to be maintained in that the CDD has to pay for it.
1:23:35 No, I'm sorry. I'm I'm jumping in here.
1:23:37 Yeah, I I'm I'm going to ask the city attorney. Yeah, the the answer is no.
1:23:41 Okay. So, who pays for it right now? If there needs to be something done on that trip, it depend what like for example,
1:23:48 what would be an example?
1:23:50 Well, it's land. So, if it needs to be mowed or it needs to be landscaped, it needs to be owner. I think Well, I think that's what I was trying
1:23:57 to clarify before. Isn't that for uh that that piece falling under the responsibility of MSTU along well? If you look at the package that they did
1:24:06 for me, the MSTU uh wellness way, all the landscaping, lighting and everything along along wellness way is fall under
1:24:13 MSTU responsibility. And that's why I said when I look at this, all that responsibility will go back to the MSTU,
1:24:20 whoever the owner within the boundary of the rightway. Right. Right away within the rightway, but this is abudding the rightway.
1:24:27 Imagine let I'm going to I'm going to use a perhaps hopefully this doesn't turn into a controversial analogy but let's just
1:24:34 pretend for a second that that was actually uh Mr. Let's pretend that that was actually your home, right?
1:24:41 For just conversation sake it says future development not in CDD. Let's say that that's your home.
1:24:46 So that hatched out piece would actually be part of your property that would be say incorrectly included in the Wellness
1:24:54 Ridge CDD and you'd be saying get this little piece of my property out of your CDD. Okay.
1:25:00 So it is that property is owned and maintained by the owner of record. So any mowing or anything like that is all by uh SLC.
1:25:09 Okay. So it's not a Okay, now I understand that that is private property to be clear.
1:25:13 So it's it's it's still owned by correct the property owner adjacent CDD never owned.
1:25:20 It just got included into the CDD through this process. Okay. All right. Now that Thank you. That clears it up.
1:25:28 Um, so I think um I think that I you know if there's a conversation to be had about holding the CDD accountable for
1:25:37 things uh this may not be the mechanism or vehicle for that. Um and it would be through conversations about what a new
1:25:44 CDD would look like and that interlocal agreement and making sure we include our concerns and and and conversations in that area. So with that, I I agree with
1:25:53 Councilwoman Strange um in moving forward on this item today. Anyone else? Any
1:26:01 I I should say too I I I think our rules require me to disclose that I did have a conversation with Mr. Register and Mr.
1:26:09 McDonald from LAR when this was uh the bigger package deal with sanctuary and
1:26:15 this contraction. Um I would say 98% of that conversation dealt with the inclusion of sanctuary um being included
1:26:24 and uh uh about 2% of that was this contraction. But I did like to disclo do want to disclose that per our rules.
1:26:32 Okay. There are no further discussion. I entertain a motion. I move to approve item number 10.
1:26:40 I second. Have a motion and a second for approval of item number 10, ordinance number 2026-011.
1:26:47 Any further discussion? Hear none. Roll call. Council member Strange. I.
1:26:53 Council member Bain I. C. Council member Myers. I. Council member Peterson. Nay.
1:27:01 And chair vote I as well. Motion passes 4 to one.
1:27:06 Thank you sir. Thank you for getting that cleaned up and thank you. Item number 11, 12, and 13 are for final consideration of ordinance number 2026-015,
1:27:18 ordinance number 2026- 016, and ordinance number 2026-17.
1:27:26 As they are the same project, they will be presented together and we will vote on them separately.
1:27:33 Ordinance number 2026015,
1:27:36 an ordinance under the code of ordinances of the city of Clermont,
1:27:40 Lake County, Florida, providing for the annexation of a certain parcel of land contiguous to the present city boundaries, providing for conflict
1:27:49 severability, administrative correction of scrivener's errors, recording publication, and an effective date.
1:27:56 Ordinance number 2026 016 an ordinance of the city of Clermont, Lake County,
1:28:01 Florida, adopting the small-scale comprehensive plan amendment for the city of Clermont, Florida, pursuant to the local government comprehensive
1:28:09 planning act, chapter 1 163, part two,
1:28:14 Florida statutes, setting forth the authority for adoption of the small-cale comprehensive plan amendment, setting forth the purpose and intent of the small-cale comprehensive plan amendment,
1:28:25 providing for the adoption of the small-scale comprehensive plan amendment establishing the legal status of the small-cale comprehensive plan amendment
1:28:34 providing for conflict severability administrative correction of scriveners error publication and an effective date
1:28:41 ordinance number 202617 an ordinance under the code of ordinances of the city of Clermont Lake County Florida amending the official
1:28:49 zoning map of the city of Clermont referred to in chapter 122 of ordinance number 289 9C code of ordinances
1:28:57 reszoning the real properties described herein as shown below providing for conflict severability administrative correction of scriveners error recording publication and an effective date.
1:29:10 Yes sir.
1:29:11 Good afternoon mayor uh council members and guests. Nickens Development Services. Uh this is the Kohl's department store uh annexation
1:29:20 small-cale comprehensive plan amendment and resoning. The applicant Kohl's department store is requesting a voluntary annexation and a small-cale
1:29:28 comprehensive plan amendment and resoning of the subject parcel for the purpose of providing the existing commercial uses with enhanced city
1:29:35 services. The property is approximately 15.9 acres and is located at 12305 US
1:29:42 Highway 27. Through coordination with the city's development liaison,
1:29:47 Zayertell, the city identified the site as a candidate for annexation, which was determined to be mutually mutually
1:29:54 beneficial for both the property owner and the city.
1:29:59 The subject property is located within the interlocal service boundary agreement area as well as a joint planning area. It is contiguous to the
1:30:07 city limits along its southern and eastern boundary satisfying the statutory requirement for adjacency. The
1:30:14 city already provides sewer services to the site and annexation would extend additional municipal services including
1:30:21 police and fire ensuring a unified and efficient level of service. The property meets all applicable requirements for
1:30:29 voluntary annexation as outlined in section 171.44 Florida statutes and is contiguous to
1:30:36 the existing city limits. Staff recommends approval of ordinance 2026 015.
1:30:44 Thank you, sir. Is the applicant present? Uh I'm going to do all three together. Okay. Okay.
1:30:48 Yep. Uh the proposed uh map amendment will change the future land use designation from Lake Countyy's urban low to city's commercial designation.
1:30:59 The property is currently developed with the commercial retail department store.
1:31:03 Policy 1.12.3 of the city's comprehensive plan encourages voluntary annexation uh which
1:31:11 uh states the city shall encourage requests for voluntary annexation into the city when those lands are logical extensions of the existing city limits
1:31:19 when services can be provide properly provided and when proposed uses are compatible with the city's comprehensive plan. The property is located along US
1:31:28 highway 27 corridor, an area characterized by established and planned commercial uses. Annexation of the site is logical extension of the city
1:31:37 boundary and is consistent and compatible with the existing development pattern along the corridor. Staff has reviewed the requests and finds the
1:31:44 proposed comprehensive plan amendment meets the requirement for voluntary annexation. Uh the planning and zoning commission recommended approval 70 and
1:31:53 staff recommends approval of the small scale comprehensive plan amendment ordinance number 2026 016.
1:32:01 And lastly,
1:32:03 the proposed reszoning would change the designation from Lake County's PUB to the city C2 general commercial zoning district. The property is currently
1:32:12 developed with a commercial retail department store. The property was originally developed under Lake Countyy's PUD resolution number 1994-110
1:32:22 Spring Valley which entitled the area for 546 single family residential units and 20 acres for up to 160,000 square ft
1:32:31 of commercial development. The property owner entered into a utility service agreement with the city on October 1,
1:32:38 1999 to receive wastewater services. As the PUD area has reached full development and no remaining
1:32:46 entitlements or land use conditions apply to the Kohl's parcel, the city's C2 general commercial designation is the
1:32:52 most appropriate zoning district. C2 is consistent with the existing use, aligns with the city's commercial standards
1:32:59 along along US 27 corridor and removes the need to rely on an outdated PUD document. Reszoning to C2 zoning will
1:33:08 ensure consistent development regulations, signage standards, and administrative procedures for this established commercial parcel.
1:33:16 Staff has reviewed the applicant's proposal and finds the proposed zoning at this location is compatible with the uses in the area. The requested C2
1:33:26 general commercial designation is consistent with the comp plan and land development regulations. The planning and zoning commission recommended
1:33:32 approval 70 of ordinance 202617 and staff recommends approval of this
1:33:39 ordinance. Uh like I said this was in coordination with the uh the city with uh our development liaison uh when Zayn
1:33:48 worked with uh their corporate office and their retail office that are out of the state. So the applicant isn't present but Zayn is here to answer any
1:33:57 further questions if uh if I don't have the answers and that concludes uh staff's presentation. Thank you.
1:34:02 Okay. Thank you. So the applicant isn't present. So we will just go to public comment. Anyone in the public wish to address either one of these items may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:34:14 Anyone in the chamber willing to address either one of these items may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:34:22 Seeing no one, I close chamber public comment. No one online. We will bring it back to council. What say council?
1:34:29 Move to approve item number 11, ordinance 2026-015. A second.
1:34:35 Okay, I have a motion and a second for approval of ordinance number 026-015.
1:34:42 Any further discussion? Hearing none. Roll call. Council member Strange. I. C. Council member Bain. I.
1:34:50 Council member Myers. I council member Peterson I and the chair vote I as well motion passes 50.
1:34:57 All right. Uh ordinance number 2026-016.
1:35:01 What say council? I'd like to make a motion to approve item number 2026-016. A second.
1:35:09 I have a motion and a second for approval of ordinance number 2026-016.
1:35:15 Any further discussion? Council member Strange. I council member Bain I
1:35:23 council member Myers I council member Peterson I and the chair vote I as well motion
1:35:28 passes 50 and ordinance number 2026-017 I'd like to make a motion to approve item
1:35:36 number 2026-017 I second have a motion and a second for approval of ordinance number 2026-017
1:35:46 further discussion hearing none council member Strange I Council member Bain I.
1:35:51 Council member Myers I.
1:35:53 Council member Peterson I.
1:35:54 And the chair vote I as well. Motion carries 50. Thank you, sir. Mr. Mayor, may I mention one thing?
1:36:02 Yes. I I just want to publicly thank Zayn for his efforts because I know we've been wanting for a decade or two to have Kohl's come into the city and
1:36:11 his individual efforts. He's not going to say that, but he got he he did what he needed to do to communicate. and I know we've been trying to do that for a
1:36:19 long time. So, I just want to give proper credit to him for his efforts. So, thanks, Mr. Mayor.
1:36:24 Well, well, we appreciate that. And I I looking at that map and everything there, we still just got them two little art parcels there in front. But great job. Like I say, it's been a long time.
1:36:34 We've been trying to do that for a while. So,
1:36:36 and of course Kurt and his team as well worked on that. So, thank you guys.
1:36:41 And Kirk leave Gerbros, what's the name of the auto body? Gerber.
1:36:47 Gerber. That's the only one that's still basically not in the city yet. Yeah. They're not in the city yet. Yeah.
1:36:56 Well, we have weird boundaries.
1:36:57 Well, we've been we've been that's what we've been working on for the last few years, trying to get them all in all the commercial and everything, but we'll we working on them l next. Okay. Item
1:37:05 number 14 and 15 are for final consideration of ordinance number 2026-018 and resolution number 2026-013.
1:37:15 As they are for the same project, they will be presented together and be voted on separately.
1:37:21 Ordinance number 2026-018,
1:37:25 an ordinance of the city council of the city of Clermont, Florida, Lake amending chapter 30 solid waste of the
1:37:32 city of Clermont city code creating a new article 3 solid waste impact fee.
1:37:38 Section 30-33 fee imposition section 30-34 adoption of technical report as basis of
1:37:46 impact fees. Section 30-35 definitions. Section 30-36
1:37:53 determination of fee. Section 30-37 collection of solid waste impact.
1:37:59 Section 30-38 solid waste impact fee schedule. Section 30-39
1:38:06 use of funds collected. Section 30-40 exemptions. Section 30-41 interpretation of article and fee
1:38:15 schedules. Section 30-42 effect on other regulations and requirements. Section 30-43
1:38:23 alter alternative calculation of solid waste impact fees. And section 30-44
1:38:30 appeals. Section 30-45 updating annual reporting and audits providing for conflict severability codification
1:38:40 administrative correction of scriveners errors publication and effective date. Resolution number 2026-013R,
1:38:49 a resolution of the city council of the city of Clermont, Lake County, Florida,
1:38:53 amending the fee schedule for impact fees, providing for conflict,
1:38:56 severability, administrative correction of scrivener's error, publication, and an effective date. Thank you. Yes, sir.
1:39:04 Ah, good evening, Mr. Mayor, members of the council. James Mayworm once again,
1:39:09 assistant director public services. With me tonight is Kevin's Kevin Winslow.
1:39:14 He's from Innovative Technical Solutions. He was on the team that put together the impact fee study for us and
1:39:21 has a short presentation that might answer any questions you have. Okay. Thank you.
1:39:28 Thank you, Jim. My name is Kevin and I work with Innovative Technical Solutions and um I help prepare the impact fee report and we just have a short uh
1:39:37 presentation on how the uh numbers were derived.
1:39:42 So the uh regulation that establishes the uh impact fee that grants it to municipal governments is outlined in Florida statute 163.31801.
1:39:54 And it basically describes how to derive the impact fees from local and recent data and um how it should only apply to
1:40:03 new uh customers in the area. And um it also describes how they should be implemented.
1:40:14 So so the numbers we got were the total is the last row and we separated them
1:40:21 based on um how much each residential customer and commercial customer be expected to pay for their impact fee.
1:40:30 And uh commercial customers will be slightly less because they don't use the yard waste services that residential customers do. Um but the total is divided into four separate categories.
1:40:42 Um the four capital costs that we'll have that go into the impact fees are for collection bins. Um, a new transfer
1:40:50 station to manage waste from a growing population and new collection and transfer vehicles
1:40:57 to manage the uh waste and send it to the landfill and then administrative costs.
1:41:06 So, I talked about the four different components. Um, the impact fees only apply to new developments using the city
1:41:14 carts. Some commercial entities don't use uh city carts to manage their waste or the city services. Um and currently
1:41:21 they're serving just over 16,000 residential customers and about 300 commercial customers.
1:41:31 So for the new collection bins category um we looked at the current cost that it costs the city to purchase bins. So MSW
1:41:40 bins, municipal solid waste will cost about 52. Same with recycle bins. And um
1:41:47 every new residential and commercial customer gets these two types of bins.
1:41:52 So we applied those two costs to the impact fee for the collection bins. And basically it's just the two combined. So
1:42:00 you get just over $100 for that portion impact fee for commercial and residential customers.
1:42:09 So, we also proposed a transfer station in our master plan that was prepared a few years ago with a design capacity of
1:42:17 675 tons per day to manage um future waste from a growing population.
1:42:24 And uh for the capital cost of the master or the transfer station, um there's several different categories that go into designing and building it.
1:42:34 There will be permitting and design costs, site prep and grading, um concrete, asphalt,
1:42:42 um truck scales, the scale house, the tipping building where the waste will be managed and transferred to the um
1:42:50 transfer vehicles and other other costs and site features such as signage and um other costs into that.
1:43:00 And the uh the portion of the cost for the transfer station only applicable to
1:43:07 um new new residents that are part of the city. It isn't isn't applied to current residents like the rest of the um same with the rest of the uh costs.
1:43:20 And then to manage the uh growing growing waste that the city is expected to have, they need to purchase new
1:43:28 collection vehicles as the population grows.
1:43:31 So we have several categories of vehicles that the city uses such as side loaders, rear loaders, clam trucks for
1:43:38 yard waste. Um and we just we we basically looked at how many customers each vehicle serves right now. So for
1:43:47 example the side loader the first category uh the city uses about 14 sideloaders right now. So divide that by
1:43:56 the number of customers is about 16,000 you get just over a thousand um side loaders per each customer
1:44:05 and then taking in the capital cost of that side loader. It's about 400,000.
1:44:10 you uh divide that by the number of customers each serves and that'll give you about $328.
1:44:16 You just do that for each each of the rest of the um categories.
1:44:21 The hauling trucks and hauling trailers are going to be for the new transfer station. So the city doesn't have current data on that, but we use data
1:44:29 from the city of St. Cloud, which used their own transfer station, and based on their data, we got those last two costs.
1:44:37 And then we just added all those up and got the uh costs for the collection and transfer vehicles.
1:44:45 So potential revenue for um the city um based on how many new uh developments
1:44:52 they have this year um we would estimate about 400 just under 450 based on this
1:44:59 year alone. Um depending on how many new uh customers a city gets each year,
1:45:05 it'll change based on basically how many uh new new developments there are.
1:45:12 Thank you. Happy to answer any questions.
1:45:15 Okay. Thank you, sir. If we have any question, we will call you back at a later time. But this is a public hearing and anyone in the public wish to comment on these items may come to microphone
1:45:24 and state your name and address and have three minutes. Anyone in the chamber wish to address these item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:45:34 Seeing no one in the chamber, no one online, I close public comment. Bring it back to council. What say council?
1:45:41 Item number uh what we doing here? Item number 14 first.
1:45:47 Um thank you, mayor. Just a uh quick follow-up question on the cost uh per
1:45:55 bins per customer. Uh with it being the seven the seven or um the total fees
1:46:02 will be $7.95.47 for a residential, 721 for commercial. When we talk about the bins, we're actually talking about a a
1:46:10 pair of bins, right? Because they they get a a waste and a and a recycling.
1:46:15 Every new customer gets one of each. a recycling and a solid waste. Yeah.
1:46:21 Should they want more, they can receive more, but there'll be an extra cost for that. But right off the bat, that's they get there. So, if they request a
1:46:28 second, it would just be the charge for that actual bin, not an additional impact fee.
1:46:36 No assessment. No. Okay. That's what I want to make sure. I forgot to ask that yesterday, so I wanted to clarify.
1:46:40 Has nothing to do with that. Typically what happens and and remember now in terms of the process
1:46:47 any new resident to the city will never see the impact fee because that is applied at time of building permit. Correct.
1:46:55 So that's disappeared in the grand scheme of things. But when they establish they have to call utility
1:47:02 billing establish their customer service with us. you know, it's at that time that they might request an additional
1:47:10 cart and then there's a small fee associated with an additional cart. Sure. Okay.
1:47:14 Typically, they live with it for a few months and then figure out it's not enough and they call us and depending upon what route we go with
1:47:23 um an actual transfer station and what size and where and all of those things.
1:47:30 uh this impact fee, part of that uh collection of that on new development would pay for 90ome% of of that rather
1:47:40 than coming out of general fund from current taxpaying residents.
1:47:45 The next step for something like this um and you'll you'll see our conversation in the proposed upcoming budget, right?
1:47:53 um is to begin design, concept planning, exploring, asking questions. What size,
1:47:59 how how much do we want to serve?
1:48:02 Clearly, we'll serve our own customers and residents, but do we want to do something more?
1:48:08 This this that will frame exactly what you designed and what we need to do.
1:48:13 Okay. So, I just want to clarify that this is kind of speculative, but we have to start someplace. Thank you.
1:48:21 Well, well, let me ask this right quick because we was talking about outside customer. I think in your report you said 675 tons per day and everything.
1:48:30 That's just our customer and that was that was estimated how many years ago?
1:48:35 That low about a year and a half, two years ago. So,
1:48:39 so even even the number that our consultant used for current customers is probably low
1:48:46 because we've we've obviously added quite a bit more since that time.
1:48:51 So, with uh the comment you just made about that service our customer what if we want to get in outside except um
1:49:01 do transferring for other cities or other outside agent would that 675 be adequate or do we look need to look at
1:49:08 larger? No, we'd have to. So the 675 was based on our buildout numbers. So when we sat down with the consultants, that was the line of questioning they asked.
1:49:19 You know, where are you going to be at buildout? And you know, you you put together your best estimate of what you're going to get. If we're going to
1:49:26 entertain other customers, no, 675 won't work. It'll be a larger number. But what
1:49:34 that number is, I I couldn't even begin to tell you. Well, that that's my concern because uh well, why I asked that question?
1:49:42 Well,
1:49:44 there has been a request for us to do other other uh transfer and everything for other cities. So, I want to make sure we we got something built in there
1:49:52 that's big enough to handle that if we decide to go that route and everything because uh those I would anticipate those conversations would be during the design
1:50:01 phase and contemplation and then I I would assume we would want if that was a direction the council wanted to go, we would need
1:50:10 some pretty significant commitments and perhaps even some contributions from other communities that wanted to participate with us because that' be a much bigger undertaking. Okay. Okay.
1:50:21 Well, that that was my curiosity about this 675. And I am because I I think that's having our own transfer station
1:50:29 is something I've been talking about for a few years as well. So, and I think we also need to take a look at the recycling program again. All right. Um,
1:50:38 keep talking about that because that's starting to cost us a lot and we really get nothing for it and we pay more for recycling than regular trash. trash and
1:50:46 everything yet and still sounds like we're gonna have an interesting conversation at budget time.
1:50:51 Yes, I think so. I keep I'm gonna keep saying that because we need to have that conversation because why keep why we keep praying these extra high cost for
1:50:59 recycling when we we getting nothing forward when it's all just group one together. We just do one tray at a lower cost. Okay. So, we need to look at that,
1:51:09 you know. So, but thank you sir.
1:51:12 Any other anybody else? Any other question? Move to approve item number 14, ordinance 2026-018.
1:51:19 Second.
1:51:21 Okay, we have a motion and a second for approval of ordinance number 2026-018.
1:51:31 Any further discussion? No.
1:51:33 Hear none. Council member Strange I.
1:51:36 Council member Bain I.
1:51:38 Council member Myers I.
1:51:39 Council member Peterson I.
1:51:41 And the chair vote I as well. Motion carries 501. Motion for resolution number 2026-013R.
1:51:52 Move to approve item number 15, 2026-013R. A second.
1:51:57 I have a motion and approval for item number 15, resolution number 2026-013R. Any further discussion? Hearing none.
1:52:06 All in favor, let it be known by saying I. I.
1:52:08 All oppose. Chair vote as well. Motion carries 5.
1:52:16 All right. Item number 16 is for surplus property sale. Good evening, mayor, council members,
1:52:25 and guests. Kurt Henchel, Planning Development Services Director. Uh, at the December 9th, 2025 council meeting,
1:52:32 council voted to surplus Whoops. Sorry, got ahead of myself.
1:52:41 we start over. Sorry about that. At the December 9th, 2025 council meeting,
1:52:45 council voted to surplus property that was originally part of the lumber yard development, which is approximately u 5,220
1:52:53 square ft, which is the yellow area in that box on your right there. The parcel was uh remaining property left over for
1:53:02 the for the location of a new city lift station. staff advertised a property for sale per state requirements and received
1:53:09 one sealed bid offer for $100. The offer The offer was from Mr. Brian Hes, the adjacent property owner, who would be
1:53:16 able to create and maintain a landscape buffer between his property and the new lift station and associated uh generator.
1:53:26 Since the property is of no value to the city, Mr. Hes would be uh responsible for maintaining the parcel for his own
1:53:33 buffer. Uh, Mr. Hess has indicated to staff that he has no plans at this time to do anything with the land except sod,
1:53:41 landscape, and irrigate it to act as a buffer between his house and the lift station and generator, but would like to reserve the right to build a garage or wall to serve as an additional buffer.
1:53:54 Staff recommends council accept the offer from Mr. Hess with the condition that the property be combined with his with his adjacent property, not to be
1:54:03 sold or developed individually for commercial purpose and be limited to open space or a structure that would complement his uh single family home to
1:54:11 enhance his buffer between the lumber yard um which again it may include a garage or a
1:54:19 buffer wall in that staff's report.
1:54:25 Okay. Thank you.
1:54:31 Does anyone in the public wish to address this item?
1:54:34 Anyone in the public wish to address this item? Make the microphone to state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:54:50 Hi, I'm Brian Hess.
1:54:54 All I would say is in advance, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Can I get your address, please, sir?
1:54:59 It's 1166 Short Street and 1177 Short Street. Thank you, sir. Okay,
1:55:06 that's it.
1:55:07 Well, I'd like to say thank you in advance.
1:55:11 Uh, you know, that building is a great place. Some of you been down there and all in there is what? Drums,
1:55:19 right?
1:55:20 It's just a nice place. If you would go ahead and bless this and do this, it'd be great. Thanks to the city staff,
1:55:27 thanks to you and you guys and Kurt.
1:55:34 It's been uh a year and I'm anxious not to have to give a speech about it. Okay. Okay. Thank you.
1:55:41 All right. Right. Thank you.
1:55:46 Uh this is a public hearing. One in the chamber wishes it may come to the microphone and state your name and their address and have three minutes. Anyone in the chamber with your address I may
1:55:54 come to the microphone state your name and address and have three minutes no one in chamber and no one online bring it back to council what say council
1:56:03 um I want to thank Mr. house. I I did meet with him at his property, um to
1:56:11 tour this, to walk this, um to look at it. Um and uh I think most people if
1:56:19 they looked at it would think it was a part of the property. So, uh I encourage council to approve this uh swiftly and move forward.
1:56:29 Okay. All right, Kirk. Uh can for me,
1:56:32 can you go back and put the stipulations in there again? Let me see the stipulations again. I think you're already on it.
1:56:41 Yeah. Was I just on it? I'm sorry. Yeah, there they are.
1:56:46 Okay. And I I want to make sure th those stay in there and everything and read and I did meet Mr. H some time back for
1:56:55 that. And one of my concerns here is the fact that one of his complaints to me was the fact that when we was the lumber yard was developing
1:57:04 uh looking at developing they were supposed to be moving a lift station right next to his property line and he wasn't happy with it and that's what I
1:57:11 went down and one of the things I looked down and looked at and of course we uh realized the property lines were messed up. So we moved and had to move the lift
1:57:19 station back because he didn't want it so close. So now we going to basically buy the buy the piece of property and put him right back next to the property
1:57:28 line a lift station. So I want to make sure in the future we don't have to have this problem about him being too close and it's going to make sure it's in
1:57:36 there that it can only be used for buffering and everything to stay away from the lift station. So um that's why I want to make sure all these things in
1:57:43 there and I thought I heard you say something about a garage. Okay. Yeah. If you want to build a garage there to put a wall in between I'm okay with that.
1:57:51 But I just want to make sure of that. So think other than that any any other.
1:58:00 All right. I entertain a motion.
1:58:01 Okay. I'd like to make a a motion to uh approve the sale of this surplus property. I second.
1:58:08 Okay. I have a motion and um second for approval of the sale of surplus property and item number 16. Any further discussion?
1:58:18 And none. All in favor? Let it be known by saying I. I I all oppose and chair vote I as well. Motion carry 50.
1:58:26 Item number 17 surplus city property.
1:58:33 So this is actually just adjacent to the property that we just sold to Mr. Hes.
1:58:38 Uh staff is proposing to surplus city property that does not serve a purpose for public use. The 1,335
1:58:46 ft parcel is leftover property between the new lift station uh at the lumber yard and the private property to the west,
1:58:54 which is the area in yellow on the right side of the screen. Initially, staff thought this parcel was included with
1:59:01 the larger surplus surplus property to the south donated by the lumberyard, but when surveyed, it was discovered it was
1:59:07 a leftover parcel owned by the city that did not serve a purpose and would only create a maintenance issue for the parcel. Once the new lift station is
1:59:17 constructed, the parcel would sit between two fences approximately 100 ft apart.
1:59:22 This area does not serve a purpose uh for public use. Therefore, staff recommends the city surplus the property. City will retain an easement
1:59:29 over the parcel for any utilities that remain underground. So there'll be surplus with property,
1:59:36 but we're going to rem maintain it for uh utilities easement. Correct. Yep. Okay.
1:59:44 This is a public hear and anyone in the public wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
1:59:51 Anyone in the public wish to address the item may come to the microphone to state your name and address and have three minutes.
2:00:00 See no one in the chamber. Anyone online? No one online. We close public comment. What say council?
2:00:06 I I take issue with this one. Um because if you look at the uh GIS or you look at the map, the city
2:00:14 owns all of the property along the trail and this would actually create a break
2:00:21 in our ownership or the city's ownership from the if you look at the south side of the trail. So, I think until there's
2:00:29 a plan for what we're doing for that entire piece of property, I would rather this be stay in the city's inventory.
2:00:38 And maybe one day we want to get rid of all of it and that'd be fine. Or maybe there's a plan. But right now, it just seems like it would be breaking up a linear strip of land that the city owns.
2:00:47 And I'd either rather do all of it or keep it until we figure out what to do with all of it.
2:00:52 Well, then in Kirk, isn't this right across from the other property we purchased before? down in there and we're looking to try to purchase another home down in there.
2:01:01 Oh, it to the north of it.
2:01:04 Yeah, we just purchased a couple of years ago. Yes. Yeah. So,
2:01:07 and well, I guess I asked the question before because uh we going to surplus it, but we going to keep it for utility.
2:01:14 So, what what's the reason for surplusing if we we want to maint?
2:01:19 Well, one is a a sale, so someone else would own it and we would just have an easement. But I mean, I could see us saying we want to do, you know,
2:01:27 landscaping along the trail or or and the property immediately to the north of the trail in this instance is owned by a family.
2:01:35 So, I just think that it's it's early. I I'm not saying I'd be opposed to it down the road, but I would I'm going to be a no to this one today. Well, I I
2:01:44 like I say, well, a property to the north owned by a family and I know we put a request in to try to try to purchase that as well along with the other two pieces we have ped along there
2:01:53 and everything, but I just I'm still trying to figure out if we going to maintain we going to have easements in there, why we need to surplus it and
2:02:01 everything. I'm kind of I'm just sitting there trying to figure out which way to go with this because it's it's not making sense to me to for us to surplus it when we need it need it for easements
2:02:10 and everything. See? So, okay. But it's my understanding if we if we don't surplus it, we have to ma maintain it,
2:02:20 right? And that's I think that's part of the Well, we we do maintain it now,
2:02:24 but now we have to continue to maintain that with zero purpose and and I guess that that was how was explained to me
2:02:32 and so ask staff to clarify that.
2:02:36 you still if it's until we sell it, we still whether it's surplus or not, we going to still have to maintain it. Okay. Unless we sell it. Okay.
2:02:45 So that's that's why I'm saying what's the purpose of of surplus?
2:02:50 So the the reason staff is recommending surplusing this is that if you look at the property to the west, which is Mr.
2:02:55 Hess's property, he owns all the way up to 5t to that to the trail, right? He's got it all fenced off. This would just shore that off to where it would line up with the other fence on the lumber yard.
2:03:06 So, we would still have five feet before the trail. That would still be the city property. This is just a leftover piece
2:03:12 that sits between that 5t and I think it's like maybe 10 or 13 feet wide. It's it's very thin, but it would just square
2:03:21 that off. So, since Mr. Hes just got the property to the south of it, this would just make it consistent so his fence line could continue around. He would still he would own the property. Well,
2:03:32 if he bids on it and gets it, whoever does that would get the property, but we would still have the easement so we could maintain any utilities underneath.
2:03:39 But the property itself on a daily basis, mowing and all that stuff,
2:03:42 irrigation would be maintained by the whoever purchases or bids for this property. Yeah. But we own everything to the east of it.
2:03:50 If unless I'm mistaken,
2:03:52 we own all but everything except for the one piece of property straight across with the homes on it. Do do we not own Christian? Can you look at this for me?
2:04:00 I thought we owned everything on the on the southeast side. It's 10.46 ft.
2:04:06 Well, plus 5.45. So, what are we? I don't know. 11 12 16 feet from the trail
2:04:14 to the property line. My understanding is the city owns what would be a contiguous legal
2:04:21 description to the southeast. Is that wrong? If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I'm not sure.
2:04:26 the city does um it's already but it already does that. It already runs into the Hess property if that makes sense.
2:04:33 Yeah.
2:04:35 So this just gives us more land if as we go through this, you know, CRA code if we if we do a landscape buffer of sorts
2:04:44 or Yeah.
2:04:45 If we wanted to widen the trail or or whatever. Yeah.
2:04:50 I just if it was just a random piece, I would say surplus it. Yes. Why?
2:04:55 Yeah, but you right next to the trail and everything else. So, if you want to widen it, you would need that and everything else. And you I mean I like I'm like I say, I'm still trying to
2:05:03 understand if if we need it for easement and everything else while we surplusing it if the city still there's a still need
2:05:10 for it. See, I I I'm with you. I rather hold on to this piece of land and until we decide what we doing with every everything else down in there. Okay.
2:05:20 But this this got confusing. Yes.
2:05:26 When Pendler did went forward and all we're trying to do is clean up this to the best of our ability with the staff and that's why we brought this forward
2:05:34 because we believe Mr. Mayor if you remember the surveys were all messed up and everything was crazy and this is our
2:05:41 attempt to work with the staff together to try to make this right. So that's why this is forward.
2:05:48 Yeah. I remember the survey was all messed up. I thought we got everything straight with all the surveys and this here, you know, like I say, uh I know
2:05:57 we made uh quite an effort and got criticized for purchasing other land down there. We pretty much own everything else down there. And why we want to just look at surplusing that long one little strip, I I don't know.
2:06:08 My markers don't work. But because of the ink, if you look at the red that we're looking at on page 490, it looks
2:06:17 to me based on this that this dotted line is the city's property boundary, right?
2:06:24 And that we own we as the city, the citizens of Clermont own everything to the north of that line up to the trail.
2:06:32 And if you look over here on the legal on the survey, what my understanding is that this line if it continues is city property.
2:06:39 City property. So to me that's potentially park space, trail space, widening of the trail.
2:06:47 And that's what until we have a plan.
2:06:50 I understand the property to the west with the lift station and Mr. Hess's property. I I understand that. But this right here
2:06:58 seems to me like there could be a purpose for it down the road. And I'm not saying no in the future, but right today I feel uncomfortable.
2:07:04 But I think we should think about, you know, we have consultants looking at these things. Exactly. Why don't we table this until we get an answer back from our consultant? I'm good with that.
2:07:12 We did. Yeah. Yeah.
2:07:13 Okay. I make a motion to table item number 17. I second.
2:07:19 Mr. Mr. U we taping it. Do we need to put a date on this? You should.
2:07:25 We should. Okay. So at this time instead of tapering it because we don't know when we getting something back from a then you could postpone indefinitely.
2:07:32 Postpone or vote vote it bring it back another time. Postpone post Trump.
2:07:37 I'm sorry mayor I might have missed that.
2:07:39 Uh well either postpone it or vote no on it and bring it back at a later time. If we vote no we could certainly bring it back.
2:07:46 You can come back at a later time but right now the table we have to put a date on it. We don't know what usually that's the best practice. Okay.
2:07:52 So he needs to change. I think we just post postpone tabledefinitely. Yeah,
2:07:58 we could say until the first meeting in August, by then we'll have the CRA. Uh we'll have the code for downtown.
2:08:06 So, we'll know what the plan is for downtown if we want to go if we want to put a date on it.
2:08:11 I just say vote um vote make a motion to vote it down and then if they when everything go through whenever it is, it
2:08:18 may be a year from now, we can always bring it back. It can always come back at that point because right now we up in the air. We don't know when. Can I ask a clarification question, Mr.
2:08:27 Peterson? Is your intent not necessarily to vote no, but to postpone it for more information? Yes.
2:08:33 Then I think we I think postponing is the more adequate motion because you're not saying I don't want that. I don't want this to go to surplus. You're
2:08:40 saying I'm not sure if I want this to go to surplus. And if that's the case, then postponing probably is the is the better option.
2:08:47 that thank you for because I want to get that clarification on that.
2:08:50 So if we say honor before the first meeting in August, does that work with everybody? I think that gives postponing. I don't think you have to put a date. Okay. All right.
2:08:58 I thought we said we could postpone indefinitely. Is that okay? Yeah, I'm okay with that. Yes, that's fine. What's the motion?
2:09:05 Postpone indefinitely. Second.
2:09:08 I have a motion and a second for item number 17 to postpone indefinitely. Um, any further discussion?
2:09:15 No, sir. All in favor, let it be known by saying I. I I.
2:09:19 All oppose. Chair will as well postpone indefinitely. Okay. Whenever we get some more guidance on what's going on down there, we can bring it back.
2:09:29 Great. Item number 18 is for request. Mayor, may I request a 10-minute recess, please? Oh, you need a 10-inut? Yes, sir.
2:09:42 Item number number 18, a verance request.
2:09:47 Good evening, mayor, city council members, and guests. Justine Day with development services presenting 4519 Lionsgate Avenue variance request.
2:09:57 The applicant, Gan Malaqua, is requesting three variances to the land development code as a result of a pending code enforcement case for
2:10:06 installed pavers without a city zoning clearance. The property is within the Hartwood Landing subdivision and is designated with the planned unit
2:10:14 development PUD zoning district by ordinance number 2019-09.
2:10:21 The first variance request is to allow for a sideyard setback to be less than the minimum 5 foot required by the ordinance number 2019-09.
2:10:31 This would allow for the existing paper walkways which are estimated to be 210 square ft each to remain on the property
2:10:38 encroaching into the sideyard setbacks at zero feet on each side of the property. The second variance request is to allow for a rear yard setback to be
2:10:46 less than the minimum 5 foot required by ordinance number 2019-09.
2:10:51 This would allow the non-conforming astroturf that was existing on the property prior to the pavers being installed to encroach into the rear yard set back at zero feet from the rear property line.
2:11:01 If the two variance requests are approved, the impervious surface ratio would increase to an estimated 90%.
2:11:09 Requiring a third variance request to allow for an increase to the maximum 75%
2:11:14 impervious surface ratio that is permitted uh per lot by ordinance number 2019-09.
2:11:22 The applicant has indicated the area was flooding prior to the pavers being installed on the property. The lot lay layout indicates storm water flows from the back to the front of the property.
2:11:32 In order to account for the flooding that has been occurring on the property,
2:11:35 the applicant proceeded to have two French drains and the pavers installed on the sides of the property. The French drains help direct the storm waters
2:11:43 towards the road in order for the development's main storm water drainage to catch the excess runoff. The applicant mentioned a practical hardship
2:11:51 and claims that the work was necessary due to the property flooding within the walkways towards the back of their property. The applicant is willing to
2:11:59 execute any required agreements or accept reasonable conditions for approval of the con uh of the requests.
2:12:07 Upon review of the applicant's request,
2:12:09 staff is unable to support the variances requested. Land Development Code section 125-484
2:12:16 specifies PUDS are specifically approved after thorough evaluation of the project's concept plan by the city council. Ordinance number 2019-09 was
2:12:26 approved for minimum side and rear yard setbacks of 5 ft from the property lines to accommodate for the minimum drainage and utility easements required on each
2:12:34 lot. Allowing encroachment into these easements and increasing the developable area may negatively impact the abuing
2:12:42 properties and the subdivision's overall storm water capacity. Under land development code section 101246, a
2:12:49 variance may only be granted with a positive finding on all review criteria.
2:12:54 Staff finds the application fe fails to meet three of the five required criteria. Therefore, staff recommends denial of the variance requests. This concludes staff's presentation.
2:13:05 Thank you. Is the applicant present? Yes. Press.
2:13:12 You don't have to press. Just speak into the mic. Your name and your address.
2:13:16 Okay. Thanks. Good evening, mayor and council members. My name is Jean Deva Malakius. I'm the homeowner of 4519 Lions Gate Avenue.
2:13:26 I respect I respectfully request approval of the variance of my property.
2:13:32 staff has already mentioned found positive finds on two of the five review criteria.
2:13:38 Uh staff has agreed that there is a practical difficulty on the profit and agree that my request is cons consistent
2:13:46 with the seat comprehensive plan. I would like to address the remaining concern as honest as I can.
2:13:53 The improvements of my prop are part of a one drainage solution not separation additionals.
2:14:00 So in 2023, the synthetic turf was installed with the drainage base. But in late 2025,
2:14:09 the sideyard pavers and the French drains were installed to fix a long longstand drainage problem on both sides
2:14:16 of the home. I don't have the proofs of uh that was staff was mentioned but I have a performance during the 2024
2:14:25 hurricane season when many properties in this area had drainage problems my prop did not fluid did not pound and did not
2:14:33 push water onto my neighbors. So my French drains worked exactly as was designed. This is a common problem that
2:14:42 neighborh in hatwood landing. Most of the neighbor has a pound in between the house is a problem that probably was
2:14:49 from the the lander and uh this was my first house high right after I moved to US. So I was zero
2:14:58 knowledge of uh how I need to investigate those things and my agent neighbors have provided support letters confirming no objections
2:15:07 and no impact in the uh properties relate related the 90% impace ratio in
2:15:15 the staff report that described as estimate and and the synthetic turf is count as full impervious even though the turf
2:15:23 system are normally installed over a permanent base. So what my asking here is not to asking the council to set
2:15:31 aside uh the staff estimate. I'm only asking you to wait against the actual performance of the property and what was
2:15:39 presented. So with that said, I respect ask the council to approve this variance with every reasonable condition you guys find appropriate. Thank you.
2:15:53 Thank you.
2:15:55 This is a public hearing. Anyone in the chamber wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
2:16:05 Hey, good day, good evening. My name is Ken. I'm actually the neighbor. I live at 4523 Lionsgate Avenue. We shared a
2:16:12 video with a neighbor yesterday. Um the side of our house close to theirs is more water versus the other side. We're
2:16:21 okay with any variances they want to make as long as um the amount of water drainage over is reduced.
2:16:29 You're okay with it as is?
2:16:31 No. No. It would it would there would have to be an improvement in the amount of water that's draining on our side because again we shared a picture with
2:16:38 him to where you can see the side closest to his house when it rains pretty good is is pretty
2:16:45 bad versus the other side. There is some water, but it's not nearly as much as as on their side. So, again, we're, you know, we would have no objections to
2:16:54 changes as long as there's no water on our side. No excess water.
2:16:58 So, so what you're saying is when it rain water from his is flowing into yours. Yeah. Because the the pavers, right? Like it's it's got to go.
2:17:05 Well, that's that's my concern with the whole thing. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, but again, we did speak to them,
2:17:11 you know, again, very nice. Good, you know.
2:17:13 Yeah. Uh, and I guess there are some things that the folks can do. So, we just wanted for the record. Yeah. Um, you know, to have this noted.
2:17:22 Okay.
2:17:22 Um, so in case something happened down the road, we would have some yada yada. I guess I don't know.
2:17:29 I don't I don't I don't really know what these things are, but I just wanted to make sure that, you know, uh, we we came and stated, you know, the impact to us,
2:17:38 right? You know, how is it affecting your your property? Okay. Yeah. Thank you.
2:17:43 Thank you. Thank you. I was curious before you leave, I do have a a clarifying question right here. Okay.
2:17:50 Is it because where you saw the water running off, was it different where the turf was versus where the pavers were?
2:17:56 We we really uh we only took uh pictures of kind of next to the pavers. Uh the the the rife didn't go in the back and
2:18:05 and you know, get whatever. So, I I can't answer that question honestly because we didn't really check for that.
2:18:11 It was more uh between the house and and and the fence there that we were really concerned about. Got it. Okay. Thank you.
2:18:19 Who's who's the own of that fence? Pardon me. Who owns the fence? You or him? So, he put the fence up. Okay.
2:18:25 Uh we we put one up in our backyard and we extended there a little bit in the front beyond where there was, but the the fence running alongside they Yeah,
2:18:33 they put that fence up. Okay. Thank you. All right. Thank you guys. Thank you.
2:18:41 This is a public. Anyone else in the public wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes. Anyone else?
2:18:49 Seeing no one else, anyone online? If not, bring it back to council. Would say council.
2:18:55 Is my understanding there's papavers on both properties? I see that now that I'm looking at this picture from the front,
2:19:01 it looks like there's pavers on the fence side and the unfenced side. He's he has a front door in his fence, right?
2:19:08 Yeah. So the neighbor on one side has the pavers as well and the gentleman who spoke does not have pavers on his side.
2:19:15 Can I speak? Yes, please.
2:19:19 Yes. Related my neighbor. This was came to my attention last evening when they first showed this to me this video
2:19:26 and what I've the same situation they have now was the exact situation I have before have the drainage
2:19:32 the pound. It's not because I have the paper now. It's because the land doing that. So when they came to me last evening,
2:19:41 what I proposed, I hired a new engineer this morning. They went to my house.
2:19:44 They went to his house this morning to evaluate the situation. And the agent said there is not relate to the pavers or the synthetic grass, but was the way
2:19:54 that the land was implemented was like a a pound in the middle. There is no way that even that I remove the paper now,
2:20:01 it's still going to have that amount of water. And the reason the only reason I have the PA now because they are proof I
2:20:09 replace the grass on that side three four times because the water was killing the grass all the time. Even one of the chains that I change all my side grass I
2:20:17 change this side as well because the water between my house and their house it's huge when drains. So what I
2:20:24 proposed to the engineer this morning if we could do something to help them from my side he said no that is not do because the water is not the water flow
2:20:32 is not to this side and the video does not showing the water from my side this side but what they propose is might be have an extra drainage pipe between our
2:20:41 land together to drain all the the water between those uh lands.
2:20:47 But his property is the one with the grass.
2:20:50 If you look at the video, there is almost nothing in grass because the grass already kill it.
2:20:54 But you have one neighbor with pavers and you have one neighbor with grass.
2:20:57 Yeah. One with paver and one with grass and he's the one with grass. He's the one with grass. Yeah. Or dirt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now it's dirt because the grass.
2:21:06 I understand. Thank you.
2:21:08 And for staff, is the property with the pavers one of the ones that we approved a couple months ago?
2:21:15 Yes. So, um, the property just directly to the north of them, I believe that's 4519. So, that would be one of the, uh,
2:21:24 properties that we previously proved for papavers on the side of their property. Yep.
2:21:29 And that's why I'm always a little leerary about proving these type things because then we we started avalanches.
2:21:36 This start reoccurring reoccurring. Um, well, I got a question for you, sir.
2:21:41 Before you did that, did you check with the HOA? I not I don't check because when I did was with my two neighbors I
2:21:48 was not in the town at that time and I just paid then and they did everything.
2:21:53 Was I supposed to come in December or January when they came but I was out of US and I couldn't come. That's the reason I'm just doing right now. If you
2:22:01 look at the pictures, you're going to see my name, my pavers is connect with the day pavers and the ad and the other pavers because we did all the same time.
2:22:09 But I didn't honest you, I didn't check with HOA because I assume at that time was not required. Again, I'm new in US
2:22:17 and try to figure out, but I soon realized that I had to get the HOA approval. I submit the HOA approval and that there is a letter for HOA here.
2:22:24 When you when you moved in, didn't you get a package from your HOA telling you spelling out what's your requirements and if you want to do certain thing with your land, you have to come to them?
2:22:33 Yeah, I got But you you didn't go and ask them. And then most likely if spelled out in the HO uh uh paperwork. Yeah, I missed that.
2:22:40 Before you do any approvements and everything on your property, you have to do it.
2:22:43 Yeah, I missed that part, but it's not excuse here. For example, the the enclosure that I had on back my my side, I got all the approvals, but that side,
2:22:52 as I mentioned, was not excuse. I was out of the town. I just went to the flow of my neighbors and now here I am. Yep.
2:23:01 Yes, sir.
2:23:01 Thank you, mayor. Um, the letter that's in our packet from your HOA association dated November of 2025,
2:23:10 when did you actually start the PA project?
2:23:15 was November 2025 the paper project the HOA came to me and notify
2:23:22 on Monday on Wednesday I submit to the HOA.
2:23:26 Okay. So you started the project relatively days before you actually applied to the to the HOA was two days. Yeah.
2:23:33 Okay. Um,
2:23:36 did you see in your HOA letter that it it indicates that they hold no liability for ensuring compliance with city requirements?
2:23:46 Yeah. Did you apply for a city permit? No. Okay. Um,
2:23:53 and then my other question is for staff, I I believe. Um,
2:23:58 is there a way for the homeowner, a homeowner to to
2:24:06 mitigate their water concerns, their their water retention concerns through like a French
2:24:14 drain without pavering and taking and removing all of the pvious service.
2:24:21 I'm going to have to defer to potentially Kurt for that.
2:24:24 Yeah, I guess my question uh Mr. ial is is there a way to do a French drain or some sort of draining
2:24:33 uh or mitigating act to try to address water retention
2:24:41 that would not re also require adding imperous service to the to the parcel.
2:24:51 Believe I follow you. So the I know those parcels are are designed without adding a drain, right? They're designed
2:24:59 to have a a swell between the houses that convey to conveys the water out and these go back to front. So this is supposed to go to the front.
2:25:07 Correct. That's right. I did just notice something on the picture that may help some mitigation.
2:25:14 Previous variances I'm trying to compare. Understood. But there's some gutters on the house. This one does not
2:25:21 appear to have any gutters on that side of the house. So just a heads up if you go that route you may require that if should you approve it?
2:25:30 Yeah.
2:25:31 So does a f I guess let me ask this directly and it's okay if you can't answer. Does a French drain system
2:25:38 require removing the pvious grass to accomplish the Yeah, because it's underneath the
2:25:47 pa. So it has to So there has to be something. Does it have to be impervious is put on top of that or can it still be pvious material on top of the French train?
2:25:58 Yeah,
2:25:58 I've seen them both. I've seen some with a grate goes straight down to it. I've seen some with pavers over them.
2:26:03 So, there could be a great There could be rather than the whole thing, there could be. It's on how you design it. Yes.
2:26:10 Right. I guess my I'm trying to get at is I I understand I I I want to be sympathetic and and and
2:26:17 understand if there's a drainage issue that residents in this neighborhood are experiencing in between their houses um that we the city can't, you know,
2:26:29 can't really assist them with because it's their it's how they're the builder maybe or somebody developed it. But
2:26:37 it seems like we're we're seeing a a method that is just tear out all the
2:26:46 pvious service and go to 90% in this case of imperous service
2:26:54 which I believe I read in the staff report that there's now uh potential concern with the the volume of water
2:27:02 runoff that's going into the retention retention area, big the big retention area that we may not even have adequate that if all of these
2:27:11 houses start doing this method that we're going to get such a volume that it may not flood your neighbor, but it's going to flood your neighborhood. And I
2:27:20 I I think we have a obligation or responsibility to consider neighbors, but also the neighborhood. Correct.
2:27:26 I'd like to offer a a proposal for how we approach this one.
2:27:30 Uh because I see two issues here. It's kind of three. I mean they're asking for three variances but I see two issues.
2:27:37 One is the issue of the pavers and if we don't think of it as pavers and we think of it instead as ingress and egress from
2:27:45 the front of one's house to the back of one's house. These particular homes were built with five foot lot lines, which means there's basically just enough room
2:27:54 for a person, whether they're they have a walker, they're in a wheelchair,
2:27:58 whatever that might be, whether they're pushing their um fill-in- thelank to pass through this. And and some homes are built with 5 foot lot lines, and
2:28:06 some people like that. Um there does seem to be a preference in this community for the neighbors to be able
2:28:13 in in a way that does present itself as beautiful. I mean I think it's it's well done. Um I'm going to suggest that we
2:28:22 break this into two pieces. One is issues related to ingress and egress from the front to the backyard using
2:28:30 pavers. Ideally permeable p pavers but in any event pavers. And I'm going to we
2:28:38 don't have to vote on it right now, but I'm going to be asking council to give staff permission to address issues related to ingress and egress using
2:28:46 pavers from the front to the back of one's yard at the staff level so long as
2:28:53 we are not exceeding the maximum permeable space on the property. In other words, this becomes a design issue
2:29:02 more than it is uh an issue of water water And I suspect that the folks in this neighborhood would appreciate being
2:29:09 able to just address it with staff rather than having to come here. And I think we're going to be very busy if we don't give staff that that authority.
2:29:17 But the second issue again two and three is the astroturf and the impact on the overall capacity water
2:29:26 capacity. And I think that they are both separate but also connected here. So on the overall capacity, I am not inclined.
2:29:34 I'll say for purposes of vote, I am not inclined to change the overall capacity of engineering. I'm not going to play
2:29:41 engineer. That's not my license. I'm not going to do that. So if the property has a 75% imperous surface ratio that is permitted, then as far as I'm concerned,
2:29:51 that's the law and I'm not inclined for purposes of voting. I'm not inclined to give a variance to that. However,
2:29:56 astroturf is not one of the approved materials in the new yard pattern book,
2:30:02 which we've adopted in the effort to encourage people to enjoy their Florida yards to be able, you know, clean air,
2:30:10 low water management. I mean, the near pattern was designed by people in central Florida who know what kind of yards we can have in central Florida.
2:30:18 What does astroturf bring you? Low maintenance. It's green all the time or it's beautiful, one might say. But it's also full of a number of toxic chemicals
2:30:26 and it affects the runoff. So that's why it's not on our approved plant list. For me today, if we want to break this out
2:30:34 somehow, I am for approving for sure the sideyard that the property is sharing with the neighbor. I think that we need
2:30:42 to I think staff needs to address with comfort the runoff. I I do I'm again I'm not going to play engineer, but I think
2:30:50 that staff can address the runoff on the other neighbors property. reasonable steps. I would rather give that issue to staff with our blessing is where I'm at.
2:31:00 But on the issue of the astroturf, I probably will never vote for astroturf unless it's on like a putt putt course.
2:31:07 Um, that's me. But I definitely am not at voting above the 75%. That's where I'm at. If we can break that down or or
2:31:14 if any of what I said sounds like it works for the other four of you,
2:31:18 that's where I'm at. I don't think there's anything mentioning about as approval or disapproval of astroturf right now. That's something you're just
2:31:26 throwing in. One of the things it's on here. It is one of the variants.
2:31:30 Gutters. You don't have gutters on this side of the house.
2:31:33 The runoff is is huge. If you put a gutter on, then you're going to feed it out to the street. Yeah.
2:31:38 So, it's going to be the same thing as if you had pavers without gutters. It's going to feed it to the street. So it's it's the same amount of water whether
2:31:46 you put gutters gutters on gr if you have if you have grass there no gutters then it'll it'll it'll drain somewhat. Yeah.
2:31:54 But if you you know if you put gutters in and then you're draining it forward to the street then you're going to have that same runoff.
2:32:01 You know what I'm saying?
2:32:02 And that's where I' I'd be comfortable saying staff figure that piece out. Can I ask a clarifying question?
2:32:09 Councilwoman Strange. Um, so it sound it sounds like you're you're maybe so there's three variances. The first variance approve I'm okay with that one.
2:32:18 Not approving the second variance and third of variance which would be the astroturf and the uh additional 15% imperous runoff.
2:32:27 That's where I'm at.
2:32:28 Increase right. That's right. For for logistics for voting and then there's a asterisk in there to to also then move
2:32:34 that ingress egress kind of of decision-m level to staff as long as it doesn't increase the the impervious and
2:32:43 go against what we have in our code with regard to uh the new pattern. Exactly. Okay,
2:32:48 that's Kirk, let me ask this question, please.
2:32:51 And she brought it that way. Uh if we move removed the asphroturf and left the papers where where where will we be on the percentages?
2:33:00 Oh, I think you'd be within the 75. Do you have that figured off? They're removing all of it.
2:33:04 If they moved all the If you left the pavers, you know,
2:33:09 um so from the previous permit that they did, they were at 42%. That's without the astroturf and the pavers on the sides.
2:33:16 But if we if we left the pavers there and removed the astroturf, where would we be? Would we be within the 75? I would have to double check. I want to
2:33:24 say yes, but I would have to double check to verify they would be within. Well, I I Well,
2:33:33 actually, I'm more inclined to leave lead astroturf rather than the pavers.
2:33:36 And the reason why why that is because with that pavers, you flooding out your neighbors. That's always a serious concern with me causing your neighbors a
2:33:45 lot more problem. As as the one neighbors already said, he he's already getting water. Um, going back to what Mr. Peterson said and what I noticed in
2:33:53 the pictures too, it was no no uh gutters on that side of the house. So when it rains, it always floods down and even when the grass in there, it's just
2:34:00 going to flood the area out. Even though it's it's probably landscape with the developer when he did everything, he should have contoured the land into the
2:34:08 V like they said where everything would ran either to the front or the back out or the yard instead or into the other neighbor's yard. And that's why I've always me when these things come to me,
2:34:18 I'm always a little skeptical about pavers and everything in between people houses, especially when you only got a 5ft lot line to begin with. Okay. Um why
2:34:28 I've always pushed to say, hey, our our city ordinance always called for at least a 7 and 12t setback on the side and we should never go below that. Okay.
2:34:37 To give that extra room in between the houses for that. Um, so I'm more in time to accept the astro turf on on the
2:34:46 backside rather than the papers in between because you're really you're really intruding on your neighbors there. And I I just I'm sorry. I have to
2:34:53 thinking the neighbors more. So if they leave the astro turf, I don't know where what's the percentage are. I'm thinking with the astroturf we'll still be under
2:35:01 75% as well. Uh maybe you have to recalculate it.
2:35:05 If you removed it if you removed the No, if you left the astroturf and took the favors out. Ooh,
2:35:09 that's that's that's the one that's going to be really close there.
2:35:13 Oh, the astroturf is more because there's not much of a front yard. I mean, right. Yeah. See,
2:35:18 astroturf is a big part of that impervious right now.
2:35:21 Yeah. But see, you can come in and but going back to Mr. Baines Bain's question about a French drain. Yeah, you can you can in come in there in between on this
2:35:30 property line, put a French drain in there with a little bit of gravel maybe uh before you you know a couple of inches or three or four inches of gravel
2:35:38 with a drain at the at the property line where everything drain hit the French drain and and and carried it out with but remove the pavers, you know.
2:35:48 Okay.
2:35:48 But then you've got ingress and essress and you start dealing now you get people who say I have a handicap. I have a I mean I can't get from the front to the
2:35:56 back without going through the house in that situation because they're having to go through the grass and you'll be hearing those requests. Yeah. You're going to hear this great. Well, you're going to get that. Well,
2:36:04 now yeah, you're going to end up when we do this. You leave it there. Everybody going to come in and say, "Hey, we got a problem with handicapping. We want to be able to pave everything and not just in
2:36:12 that subdivision, but all over the city." See, that's the problem you have here. And that's what on other problem you have with these small size setbacks.
2:36:22 thing which I've been you know Kirk I've been after that for years you know because uh when you have these small setbacks you have no way of getting back and uh
2:36:30 to the back side of your house and everything that's one of the reason I've always complained about it and um wish I always said I wish we had 10 foot
2:36:38 setbacks on the side so you can be able to do these things you know but this is one of the things of that neighborhood so what what do you want to do all right
2:36:46 uh I I would like to see him get under under the within the 75%.
2:36:54 Okay. But I know he can't keep the astroturf and the paver. So which one which tradeoff we're going to do here?
2:37:01 Do we want to start with the 75% because we might I I'm kind of trying to read your faces and I'm thinking we might all agree that we want to be under the 75%
2:37:09 because that's one of the very Well, I'm saying under 75. Well, we don't want to exceed the 75%. Yeah. Okay.
2:37:14 I mean, is that somewhere we might want to start to tackle this one?
2:37:18 One of the things, you know, I mean, if you know, I think the gutters is a huge thing here because if you want to put pavers, then you you might have to
2:37:26 mandate that you put gutters if you put pavers in, you know, and then then it then it really the runoff doesn't really come into play anymore because the
2:37:34 gutters are going to carry the majority of the water off. The little bit that comes in is just so the French drain is almost like not really necessary.
2:37:43 But I think and one picture we see is there's pavers on both sides. So both neighbors aren't going to complain because they both have it, right? As long as they put gutters in, you know,
2:37:51 that mitigates the the additional. Now,
2:37:55 astroturf, I understand what you're saying.
2:37:57 It it's going to put toxic chemicals into the ground and everything else.
2:38:01 Well, and it's just not an approved material.
2:38:03 I think that's we're not really voting on the astroturf at this point. It's variance number two.
2:38:07 We we looking at the variances. It's two different variances here. We got of course we approve these two variances and that that comes into play a third variance. Okay. Uh, and back to what you're saying about the gutters.
2:38:18 Even without the gutters, if it's grass there, it's still going to cause flood because you have so much water coming in. That's what it's kind of four variances. Okay.
2:38:25 I was just about So, Kirk, do you think that is a feasible um solution what Mr.
2:38:30 Peterson said about the gutters for the because I want a solution for the Oh, it would definitely help. That's what I was saying earlier. Highly recommend if you decide to approve it,
2:38:39 require the gutters on the propert.
2:38:43 Then we still need to get done under the 75%. So which the favors of the astroturf, right?
2:38:49 I need you to we need y'all to calculate that for us, I guess.
2:38:52 Well, Nick and and John over here calculating they very confident removing the astroturf, they'd be within the 75%.
2:39:00 That's not a question. It's the if it's the other way around,
2:39:04 leaving the astroturf and removing the pavers is that's going to be really close. Can I take a stab?
2:39:08 It doesn't sound like you're going to meet it. Okay, I'm going to I'm going to move to approve
2:39:14 the first variance number one and not approve the second and third
2:39:23 variances. And my my rationale for that is um to address the ingress egress
2:39:31 sideyard. Um but the reality is is we're not I don't think I can support the the
2:39:38 um decreased rear yard setback which is a result of the astroturf and I cannot
2:39:47 support increasing the impervious surface area from 75 cent 75% maximum to
2:39:54 90% maximum. I don't necessarily need to feel the need to require an individual homeowner to put gutters on. I think
2:40:03 it's up to them. Do they put the gutters on to to address the for but I don't I don't I don't know that we need to tell them that the it's
2:40:11 gutters or pavers. I think it's we tell them you you can't supersede what's required and you have to get to that percentage. And that's where I would be
2:40:20 a little bit more comfortable with approving variance one but not approving variances two and three. I'm gonna second for purposes of discussion.
2:40:27 Oh, okay. Okay, good. We But here's the problem right there. We're gonna have to put something in there because you're flooding out your neighbor.
2:40:33 I was about to say, what about the neighbors with those pavers to the other side?
2:40:38 Your neighbors are being flooded and due to his hit runoff if you don't put something up there to prevent that on them pavers. See,
2:40:45 my I I agree with with all what I think are three of you. I fear we might be crossing into engineering and I don't
2:40:53 want to do that. So, that's my hesitation. I completely agree with you as the homeowner. Um, but I I do want to be careful, and Christian, I'm probably going to ask for your take on that one.
2:41:03 Um,
2:41:05 but I want to ask you, Mr. Bain, are you comfortable if they have the mandatory setback but still have astroturf because both are non-conforming?
2:41:14 Like, if he was to say, I'm going to cut in whatever the setback is, but keep the rest astroturf.
2:41:20 How do you feel about that? I think they're pretty close to the setback, right? Well,
2:41:26 I I guess um I don't know that there's a way for them to conform to the 75% with
2:41:33 the AstroTurf and it's going to be close, but what I envision as a potential is there's one side of the property that shares a PA with a neighbor, which they might say,
2:41:42 "We're going to keep that one because there's no conflict there." And so if you go to the back on that side of the property, you could be getting to astroturf, cut in a landscape buffer
2:41:50 along the back and sides of your property and you might be getting under your 75 ft, which still creates a scenario where the astroturf is I'm not saying they'll do it. I'm
2:41:58 just trying to envision what they could do. Yeah, I I'm not a fan of the astroturf.
2:42:02 It's not something I would like to see uh in in in used in
2:42:09 large numbers uh throughout the the community just because I think it's a well and I think it's there's a misnomer
2:42:15 that it is uh actually helps with water runoff and it actually doesn't. Uh it it's like putting concrete down
2:42:24 basically uh in terms of the water runoff.
2:42:28 Yeah. Well, I might I'm concerned with the 75 ft and other my other real concern is the neighbor that's being flooded out. Okay.
2:42:37 Yeah.
2:42:38 Are you comfortable if the neighbor speaks again? Yeah. Come on. Come on, sir.
2:42:42 So, I'm sorry. I guess my concern here is the flooding on my side. That's why I'm here, right?
2:42:50 And I it kind of seems like you want to approve the one with the pavers that impacts me.
2:42:56 So again, I'm very concerned that I'm going to lose out here if there's not
2:43:02 something done to ensure that there's not as much. I mean, we took videos and all kind of stuff of the amount of water.
2:43:11 Yeah.
2:43:11 So, again, I'm I'm really concerned about the long-term impact on my home here. That's that's kind of why I'm here and been sitting there for hours, right?
2:43:18 Like and and it's kind of it's like it's being missed here. And I just I I want to just pause and say the side of my
2:43:25 house is flooding because of the pavers we believe. Right.
2:43:31 I just want to on the record. So we all No, we didn't have any pictures, but I know when I got video I don't know. I I you know
2:43:39 of of the two sides again. And I don't know if I can upload it to something for you guys to review, but I do have proof
2:43:47 showing yesterday when it was really really hard raining,
2:43:52 the side closest to my house to his and then the other side where there's a lot less.
2:43:57 So again, I just I'm just I'm not a little I'm not real comfortable with kind of the direction we're shifting here.
2:44:04 I didn't I don't know. I don't there's no picture of your house. Do you have gutters on the side of your house?
2:44:08 I do not. We actually got an estimate today, but we do not have gutters. Okay. See,
2:44:13 so you got a rain from his house, his house, but then again, nobody's got gutters. Yeah.
2:44:17 Everything coming in that that that little V or whatever they should have put in there and everything. It's not just going it's not going to handle all that. So, you almost need gutters.
2:44:26 Is there a way that he can upload the video so we could see what he's speaking of? Well, is there a way? Well, first of all,
2:44:33 his testimony is evidence. We're not swearing people in.
2:44:36 He shared this. I mean this is not like you know we you know um so it's your you know it's your determination as to the credibility and is it enough and that kind of thing. But
2:44:45 I will say that you know normally when you deal with a variance the burden is on the applicant right and and you have to have all five of the
2:44:52 elements in order to justify the variance. So I don't think it's necessary to prove a defense. It's the applicant needing to prove you the five elements are there.
2:45:01 Right. What about the issue of crossing into the line of being engineers versus Well, I'd rather you not be, right? That's what I'm saying.
2:45:10 But but you do have the discretion to make conditions. I mean, I I don't So, if we made a condition to put gutters in this case because we have the neighbor saying,
2:45:19 "Oh,
2:45:20 that's that's what I'm talking about. I don't want to make it sound like I'm a I'm that works and therefore the city's liable because we say put gutters and that will solve your problem."
2:45:29 It's really a staff question, I guess.
2:45:30 Um, I don't know. Are gutters, what kind of gutters would that be appropriate? That seems dangerous to me. That's where I'm at.
2:45:38 We ain't going We ain't going. I think Wayne can put the video up for you. So, slow down the camera.
2:45:46 You got video on your phone? Okay. Can Can we get that?
2:45:54 Will will we be able to He can send it to us. Yeah. Okay. also said it. Right.
2:46:01 So, let me uh I think we've already established that there is going to be just this as testimony is about we're going to be able to see I'm assuming we're going to
2:46:09 see you know I mean we the thing is do we want to like Miss Stranger said do we want to get involved
2:46:18 in engineering where we say well how much water will the will gutters take off whether it be 5 in gutter or 6 in
2:46:26 gutter what's divided what is it discharged to does it have to be down There. There we go. Just a moment. Yeah, that's pretty. Sorry.
2:46:34 That's a lot of water. Yeah. You see, that's what I'm saying. So, you know,
2:46:38 and that's from yesterday, which really wasn't that bad. Yeah. The wife's hand with our study,
2:46:43 but you can see all that. Yes. All that's the water we're talking about.
2:46:47 But it looks like that's coming off of your roof and hitting his gutter, his wall. Do you have a picture of the other side of the property?
2:46:54 Of of my house, not on that side. The other side that doesn't have pavers? Yeah, it's right here. Wait, hold on.
2:47:05 Now, be careful what we end up sharing. Yeah. No, no, no, no.
2:47:12 This has been a heck of a meeting.
2:47:15 Well, no, there's Listen, I've got pictures of my kids in the tub and I I don't you know, you see how different that is. Yeah, that is a big difference.
2:47:23 That that's that's you know, and that's a side away from the paper. So, there's clearly something there.
2:47:28 Yeah. But and again, I don't know if it's the kind of stuff in the backyard or what, you know, we just were concentrating on the side of the house.
2:47:36 Well, well, what I'm looking at from the other side, what I think I'm seeing is the fact that you got this water coming off yours and of course they meeting in that swell there and and causing the
2:47:45 congregation uh collection of water there and it should have been I don't know uh tilted and drained back towards the back
2:47:54 of the house or the front of the property or towards the front so it doesn't just sit there. But with with all the extra water coming off here
2:48:02 because of the pavers there, his hot water has nowhere nowhere to go high. Mr. Bain, if you would entertain it, I'm going to withdraw my motion.
2:48:10 Okay, there we go. So, I'm I'm going to take a stab at this one. Um, let me see if we can
2:48:18 Let me break this down. I'm going to move to approve the pavers on the
2:48:26 What are we? What is that? the east side of the property where the other neighbor has it other neighbor. So, let's start with those.
2:48:33 I'm going to move to I'm going to move to approve a variance for the pavers on the east side where the neighbor also has pavers. Second that. Okay.
2:48:40 Okay. Let's call that question. Okay. Second.
2:48:43 So, we're going to make that I want to treat they both have to do that.
2:48:49 No, we I don't think we want to establish that precedent either because she we start doing that everybody going to come in. Everybody going to have
2:48:57 paper. We going to Well, and legally, I think our attorney would tell us that a variance does not establish precedent. No. No. That is correct. No. Yeah.
2:49:05 Each variance has to be considered on its own merit. So, are we comfortable calling this one? Well,
2:49:13 was it seconded? Yes. Yes, I second. Okay. Are So, can we have a discussion? Um,
2:49:18 I I think something the city attorney just said clicked with me and I feel like uh no disrespect at all to the applicant, but I feel like we are
2:49:27 working harder to get this variance requested request approved than the applicant is. Yeah.
2:49:34 Um, and really the burden of the proof really relies on the applicant to tell
2:49:39 us and show us, okay, we hear staff said negative to one to five things. Here's
2:49:48 where I I I disagree with that and here's how I've mitigated that or here's how I've worked with that. Here's how I've accomplished something to not
2:49:57 negatively affect my neighbors and my neighborhood. Um, and I just feel like maybe in this case that has not happened. I know we had some
2:50:05 conversations about individuals with disabilities and working with with their papavers and access and and you know
2:50:13 they they presented material that that essentially addressed the negative findings and I just don't feel like we actually have that. And thank you for the city attorney. I don't know if that
2:50:21 was intentional or not, but you really refocused me on that. And I think I'm sorry, sir, but I can't I can't support
2:50:28 the variance requests at all. I feel like we're doing the heavy lifting here.
2:50:33 Um, and trying to make excuses for why the negative, right,
2:50:38 finding should be overturned rather than actually being presented it and judging it. Um, and that's kind of what we're supposed to do with variance. So, I'd
2:50:46 like to see us just move forward with with denying and if he wants to come back and and has a new plan, we can entertain that.
2:50:53 I I agree with you, Brian. We have spent 40 minutes on this.
2:50:56 Okay. Well, give me another motion. I think we'll use a motion on the floor. You withdraw your motion, right?
2:51:01 I did earlier, but then Miss Strange and and Miss Meyers have a motion on just the papavers on the east side. Okay.
2:51:08 So, that's on the floor. I look at it differently that he he has letters from the neighbors on and the neighbors I mean I'm seeing that they're working
2:51:16 together on that. I I'd like to keep the motion for the papers on the east on the east. Okay.
2:51:21 Just those and and to address the rest separately.
2:51:25 So we So you want us to vote on just keeping the papers that he has with the neighbors already and then do we want to
2:51:32 deny the rest of it so that this gentleman's property isn't um continue with excessive rain water or whatnot
2:51:39 and we get back under this back below 75%. Yes. Okay.
2:51:45 So I'll amend the motion to say to approve the papavers on the east side that join the neighbor who has papavers on the east and deny the rest of the variant and I second amendment. So
2:51:53 basically what we're saying, you got to remove the paper from the other neighbor side and the and the and the astroturf. Yes. Okay.
2:52:00 And and I I would like to address one other issue when we're done that doesn't relate to these variances. Okay. Okay. So we need a vote. Okay. Yeah. Yes. I have a motion.
2:52:09 Everybody need understand the motion? Yes. Okay.
2:52:13 Any further discussion? Not all in favor? Let it be said. Let it be known by saying I. I. All oppose. Nay.
2:52:20 And the chair vote I as well. The motion passes 4 to one. Okay.
2:52:26 And I probably am seeking it's it's related in the context of it came up because of this, but um
2:52:33 I feel like this could have been addressed at the staff level and I I don't know the proper way to to direct this in the future to staff or to give
2:52:41 staff authority if we want to to be able to address that issue of ingress,
2:52:45 egress, pavers, 5 foot under the permeable surface. I think staff could have done this because they got everything right. It's a non-conforming material. It's under 75. It's over 75%.
2:52:57 I mean, staff could have done this.
2:52:59 Well, staff would have done this had he come to staff exactly and asked to begin with. The problem is he didn't ask the HOA and he didn't come
2:53:07 to the city and ask for permitting or anything. Had he done that, that all would have been accomplished.
2:53:14 Talk me through the difference of that because this came at from a code enforcement.
2:53:19 calls a code enforcement action that caused this. We brought it here. See,
2:53:23 so is there if these people had come, they still would have gone through this process,
2:53:32 right, of having to go through the variance with counsel. Even if they had applied for a permit, they still would have had to. Yes, they would need variances.
2:53:39 They would have had to go through the variances process because that all would have been explained to them in the beginning before they did the work. And
2:53:46 there are some cities and counties that actually have a policy that says if it gets to the point that they have a code
2:53:53 violation, they will not grant the variance. Like they won't they won't even do it. City does.
2:53:58 There's some that do that and that's a policy thing that you all could take up if that's the way you feel about it as well. We don't have that yet.
2:54:05 Um so that's why it's in front of you.
2:54:07 And Miss Strange, that's one of the reasons I asked the question about his HOA. Did he talk to his HOA to begin with? and all this stuff. These type things would have been spelled out
2:54:15 through the HOA policies. They went to the HOA. They probably would have directed him, hey, we don't have a problem, but you need to go to the city.
2:54:21 Well, that's what the letter said from his HOA that we'll approve it if you if the municipality approves it, right?
2:54:28 So, they just kind of pushed it to us and we're not approving it, therefore they're not approved.
2:54:33 But keep in mind also, he started the project before he even went to the HOA still. See,
2:54:37 and and that's why I don't want to make it about his particular application. I'm questioning how we feel because again,
2:54:43 we have a a neighborhood that's going to have these situations. We've now dealt with them more than once.
2:54:48 How do we feel about allowing staff to be able to grant Mr. Matis, you have talked to me about this before where
2:54:56 staff, what do you call it when staff administrative variances?
2:54:59 Administrative variances. That's what it is. or where in some jurisdictions they'll do it where staff can do 5% up to 25 even 50% administrative variances
2:55:08 on on things like setbacks impervious surface stuff like that if there's just cause and they meet certain criteria but we'd have to be clear what criteria you
2:55:17 want to make sure so we're following the rules and not I'm not comfortable giving that to staff I think if they come in for
2:55:24 variance like staff always it need to come to us let us take it up on individual call because 5% and the difference in all these different
2:55:32 variances. It's just I think that's putting a lot of more load on the staff to have to sit there and try to make that judgment and do all these and
2:55:39 what's that um might we like I say in the past when we've done these these granted these before. I mean, I think we've done several of
2:55:48 these and we've always tried to stipulate that hopefully we don't have anybody else in the community coming to do these things. Uh because we grant one
2:55:56 and really try to stress to the people out residents out there that they really need to talk to HOAs and always check
2:56:03 with the city to see see what the city says. See, and and we just get too many of these we get these all the time where they come in and oh, I didn't know this.
2:56:12 I didn't know that. See? Sure. And a lot of people don't. I mean,
2:56:16 how but are we I mean, I'm seeking council's direction.
2:56:20 My direction would be if if staff wants to come forward with a proposal for administrative variances that they present it to us and we discuss it and vote it up or down.
2:56:30 Sounds good. Great.
2:56:31 Rather than try to hash out what they can or can't bring to it already.
2:56:36 Well, I I'm just saying I don't I I have zero interest in having this conversation right now. And and so that's why I'm saying if staff wants to
2:56:43 bring something to us, staff has that purview to do that. I don't think we need to. I think we're too tied to what just happened to separate it. And I I I
2:56:52 think if we want to actually have an earnest conversation, let's have something in front of us to discuss and actually view and and and see if this
2:57:00 makes sense, not related to a specific request or house or parcel. And if not, we just move forward or we adopt it.
2:57:08 Okay. Well, well, that's it. We've been here long enough at church.
2:57:12 If you don't want to do it, you give us a proposal. We going to move on. We're not going to get in that discussion. I want to move on to the next item. I think we took a vote here
2:57:20 and everything. You know, we finished with this one.
2:57:23 Item number item number 19 is the consideration of resolution number 2026-007R.
2:57:30 A resolution of the city council of the city of Clermont, Lake County, Florida,
2:57:35 granting an amendment to conditional use permit resolution number 760 to expand the existing church use located in the
2:57:43 R3 residential professional zoning district providing for conflict severability, administrative correction of scriveners error, publication, and an effective date.
2:57:57 As you're preparing this, my recollection was there was a PNZ
2:58:04 summary on this. Is it in our It was uh I believe in our uh is it supplemental?
2:58:11 Our supplemental at last time. Oh, shoot. Yes, ma'am.
2:58:18 Good evening, mayor, city council members, and guests. Justine day with development services presenting a manual church um Temple Church CUP application.
2:58:28 The applicant Michael Leam with Gator Sketch is requesting to amend and replace resolution number 760 to expand their existing church use to parcels
2:58:36 designated with the R3 residential professional zoning district. The properties uh as shown on the map highlighted in yellow are located east
2:58:45 of the Bloxom Avenue and East Montro Street intersection and is approximately 93 acres.
2:58:52 The church located on 709 East Montro Street designated on the map as area 3 is proposing to expand their use to
2:58:59 construct a new 2250 ft building on 743 East Montro Street depicted on the map as area 1. The
2:59:08 existing building located in area 1 has a legal non-conforming church use that has been operating in conjunction with the church since 1992 based on the
2:59:17 information provided on Lake County Property Appraisers website. The proposed expansion is being requested so that the church may be able to accommodate their anticipated growth.
2:59:29 The new sanctuary would provide approximately 130 seats and allow the church to separate its uses between buildings. The current sanctuary would
2:59:37 be repurposed for Sunday school use while 709 East Montro Street would support ancillary functions and provide for overflow parking when needed.
2:59:48 The applicant is requesting three waiverss along with their request to redevelop the church in a way to make use of their size constraint parcels. The first would be to allow for off-
2:59:57 street off-site parking within a parcel outside of the central business zoning district required by land development code section 115-17.
3:00:06 This would allow the church to utilize all three sites to accommodate for the minimum parking requirements. Parking spaces would be placed mainly on the
3:00:14 vacant parcel north of 70 743 East Monro Street designated as area two on the map while 709 and 743 East Monstro Street would provide seven stalls on each site.
3:00:26 The second and third waivers are requested to allow for a reduction to the minimum landscape requirements per land development code section 12343D.
3:00:35 The applicant is proposing to reduce the landscape buffer width from 10 to 5 feet as well as a reduction to the minimum amount of plantings for the perimeter
3:00:43 buffers. Both areas in which the reduction would occur would be along the side and rear property lines for 743 East Monstro Street and the vacant
3:00:52 parcel to the north. This would allow the applicant to improve the site while still complying with the applicable land development code requirements for
3:00:59 parking, storm water, and accessibility while still providing screening between the abuing properties.
3:01:07 Staff has reviewed the application and finds that the use would not be more obnoxious to the district due to properties not having any substantial
3:01:15 code case complaints made since the church has been in operation. The proposed expansion of the church does not appear to be detrimental to the
3:01:22 health, safety, and welfare of the surrounding community. And the city's comprehensive plan supports public facilities and or institutional uh land
3:01:31 uses such as churches within residential land use categories pending approval of a conditional use permit. The city has
3:01:39 received one letter of opposition from the property located at 7-Eleven East Montro Street proposing conditions to resend their letter. Since the letter
3:01:48 has been received, the applicant and property owner have worked out the requested conditions. The planning and zoning board recommended approval 7 to
3:01:55 zero with the adoption of the proposed conditions to the resolution. Staff has no evidence that the proposed use cannot
3:02:03 meet the general criteria for granting a conditional use permit per land development code section 101212 and recommends approval of the
3:02:10 conditional use permit with the conditions contained in resolution number 2026-007. This concludes staff presentation.
3:02:19 Thank you ma'am. Is the applicant present? Michael Laam, Gator Scotch Architects,
3:02:28 1000 East Highway 50. I'm here to answer any questions you may have.
3:02:34 I like that. Short and sweet. Okay. Th this is a public hearing. Anyone in the public in the um
3:02:42 in the chamber wish to address it may come to the microphone and state your name and their address and have three minutes.
3:02:50 Good afternoon.
3:02:52 My name is Denise Latner or Denise McGee Latner. I reside at 7316 Japarondi Drive, Austin, Texas. The property is
3:03:01 7-Eleven that I own, 7-Eleven East Montro Street here in Clermont. It is a family home. I visit there all the time.
3:03:10 Um the only thing I'm still opposing is the um easement between the properties
3:03:17 from five from 10 to 5. I would like it to remain at 10.
3:03:23 I am okay with that. They're no longer putting a private fence on the west side of the building between 7-Eleven and 709.
3:03:33 That's my understanding. And also that the parking behind 709 is not a
3:03:41 permanent parking where there's not asphalt or cement. If grass,
3:03:47 I do not want that to happen. Uh and I think that was agreed upon. Um also my
3:03:54 other concern is that I live in Texas where we have no water.
3:03:59 There is a lot of ways to improve the property put in shrubberies droughtresistant
3:04:06 shrubbery that will last without someone being there to tend to it all the time.
3:04:12 So, because it's going to be a large footprint with the new building and the parking, that's a large footprint on
3:04:20 that street. It needs to be updated and the property needs to look nice.
3:04:26 That's my only concerns at this time. Okay. Well, thank you, ma'am.
3:04:33 Um, let me um Miss McGee. Yes, sir.
3:04:38 Let me understand. And you say the property, what's that? 709. Is it on the corner?
3:04:43 It's on the corner. That's on the corner. You say you don't want to see pave, but it's okay for the grass grass. Okay. Absolutely. Okay. I want to make sure I clarify.
3:04:51 North fencing. Okay. All right.
3:04:56 And other other concern with the uh 10 foot buff. All right. This is a public hearing. If we have any more questions later, uh this is a public hearing.
3:05:04 Anyone in the chamber wish to address this item may come to microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
3:05:11 Anyone in the chamber wish to address this item. Seeing no one close out of chamber and no one online, we bring it back to council.
3:05:20 Okay. Wow. Here we go again with the with the setbacks and buffers and all.
3:05:26 Okay. Which is always a thing. Um, Mr. engineer.
3:05:33 My concern is the 10 foot setback. If you go if you go from five back to the 10 feet is we would that how much problem would that cause?
3:05:42 They would not be able to build the project.
3:05:44 They would not be able to build a project. No, sir.
3:05:46 You could make the building a little bit smaller and build a project? No, sir. Okay. All right.
3:05:53 And which setback are we talking about with the 10 foot? Sorry, there's
3:06:01 Right. So the to the north we're talking about site plan area number two
3:06:07 for parking to be on that site 5- foot setback physically has to be established
3:06:14 and not 10. And then on the space where the new sanctuary is going the five foot
3:06:22 the building uh the existing building is already an encroachment of a 10. Sure.
3:06:27 So the five was there and then the pond on the back side we're going to say plan
3:06:33 down. Uh the the five ft is necessary there. And then on the adjoining uh
3:06:40 space uh the five is there just to make everything cohesive.
3:06:45 And we were going to put a six-foot uh privacy fence around this building on area one and then also area two. There
3:06:54 is no privacy fence going on area three and there is no paving on area three.
3:07:02 But the paving on par area one the is not restricted to the handicap spaces. It's all of it or it's just already a an existing gravel there.
3:07:14 We're not changing that. We are only putting concrete for the two handicap spots. Okay, that's what I understood. Mhm.
3:07:22 And then on the north, um, that's grass parking with parking stops.
3:07:27 And so the north, the issue is where the landscape buffer is, the five versus 10 ft. That's correct. And they need 24 because of the code.
3:07:36 We need 24 plus uh a parking space on either side because of the code.
3:07:44 Can they do golf cart parking instead? Unfortunately, no, ma'am.
3:07:51 I think I don't think most of most of most of his uh members going to be driving golf carts. A lot of his members are from out of town and everything. So,
3:08:00 I'm very familiar with the property and everything, but uh that's why I was saying can we make it a little bit smaller. It's it's I I I want to see him do something and
3:08:09 I've been wondering how long it going to be before they they try to put a bigger building in there and everything, but uh I think we may be trying to go too big
3:08:16 for the piece of property. uh all if you're encroaching on the neighbors again, you know, I I have to be aware of
3:08:23 the neighbors and everything. But uh that's why I ask can the building be a little bit smaller and we end up with a 10 ft cuz I uh gator I see 32 feet here.
3:08:34 Is that 32 feet?
3:08:40 I'm trying to figure out where that 32 feet is that between the building and and the fence line there. This 32 ft here.
3:08:50 I'm sorry I didn't hear the question. I was answering a question.
3:08:53 This 32 ft here. Is that from here to here or what?
3:08:56 That is between the building and the property line.
3:08:59 So we couldn't we couldn't take off 5T of that. Move move move that that back a little bit more to get 32 is to the AC unit.
3:09:09 Yeah. But also we're draining the property uh off the left hand side between the building
3:09:16 and the uh bypack uh to the pond. Sir, can you speak?
3:09:22 It apologize. It can be you drain it to the to the west. Yes, sir.
3:09:27 Not to the east where you got the big opening back here between the existing church and everything that open. The church wants to use that space.
3:09:37 Okay.
3:09:41 What is that? What are that going to be used for? I I don't know. We can ask.
3:09:47 Yeah. I'm curious. I mean, with you got the existing church and you got that opening in there. So, uh yeah, all the
3:09:54 to me that be more logical to do the drain back there. Your drainage back there.
3:09:58 All the entrances to the the existing building are on the right hand side as well as uh the new sanctuary.
3:10:06 Yeah.
3:10:13 I'm curious, were all these neighbors I don't see any letters of support in
3:10:19 here from the neighbors and this is a pretty intense expansion of use. I
3:10:26 appreciate Miss Laam's bas basically if you look at it is well really one neighbor actually I thought
3:10:34 it was another neighbor that would be in to say something but this is the only neighbor that I I think it's really going to affect is hers because she's
3:10:42 right next door to it and actually she sit between site three and site one I'm in the middle and I don't have a
3:10:49 issue with the property line or the decrease in the ement between 709 9 and 7-Eleven, which is my property.
3:10:59 No, let me take that back. I don't have a problem with the easement on 70 between 7-Eleven and 743. Okay.
3:11:07 Between your property,
3:11:08 Between your property and the one to the east, right? To the east. You're okay if that one's at 5?
3:11:12 I'm okay. My other concern is that they've been great neighbors. Okay. The church has been a great neighbor.
3:11:20 That's good. However,
3:11:24 I own that property. If something comes down line, I have to sell that property. No one's going to buy that house.
3:11:32 Let's just be frank. They might buy it.
3:11:38 I'm not suggesting they should, but um so maybe maybe I'm mistaken. So, you're not concerned about the 5-ft setback
3:11:46 between the church and your house, but the other piece?
3:11:50 I'm more concerned about the easement between SPA3 and and my property because I would
3:12:00 currently there's I I will not have access with them putting a fence up. I would not have access to my backyard at all. And that's why it comes in. They've
3:12:07 been great neighbors because we've had to use their property, get onto our property whenever there's large, right,
3:12:14 issue, construction or whatever is happening. Um, the other thing is that Duke Energy has had to come on their property, which they have to go through
3:12:23 their property in order to service my property.
3:12:27 So, I understood your concern with the setbacks being on site plan area to the parking lot, but your concern is 709.
3:12:36 Yeah. And why can't I? That's not a parking issue. No. Well,
3:12:41 well, and I'm mistaken, too. I was under under the impression you were concerned with the setback on on 743.
3:12:48 No. And I give kudos to your PNZ board.
3:12:51 They were very thorough and we went through all of this and her sister was here. We were very and we all agreed to
3:12:58 that we would not change anything on the west property. We would not put up a fence. we would not do any uh paving or
3:13:07 anything so that she could maintain you know the quality of her property.
3:13:12 So 709 the site of 709 going to remain as is. Yes sir. Nothing being done right. And can you be happy with that ma'am? I am happy with that.
3:13:21 Okay. Cuz I I I'm miss I was under impression you were concerned with the uh setback at 743.
3:13:27 It's already so tight it's not going to make a difference. saying my other concern that I already brought up is that when the gentleman was talking
3:13:34 about the circle pond or the center pond when he brought up it increases the value when you do landscaping.
3:13:42 Yeah.
3:13:42 Oh, I see. So, your concern I understood you had a concern with the setbacks on one of these three parcels and I I think that's one of two concerns I had.
3:13:51 Okay. Yeah. So, one is landscaping. Yes, I'm with you. And then the other one,
3:13:56 which parcel is the one you're concerned about, the setbacks or the landscaping buffer? Site three. Three.
3:14:02 Site three. And we've agreed. And it's planning and zoning. The conditions of planning and zoning reflect your concerns.
3:14:09 Yes, they did.
3:14:10 Okay. So, today the biggest concern is that we have an appropriate landscaping plan that will increase the value of your real estate considering how much
3:14:19 parking we're adding around your real estate. Well,
3:14:21 parking and the the footprint of the whole project around their their project have adequate landscaping around there, which
3:14:29 they should have to submit a landscaping uh uh plan anyway. So, yeah.
3:14:34 Is that how that normally works from here? If we give the approval, then they come back with a landscape plan later or it's included in this site plan.
3:14:44 Site plan.
3:14:44 It would be it would be part of the whole site. Just know it it just come back. It just come back to they got requirements so many trees so many
3:14:53 plants so many this that has to be out there. Okay. And that have to be all done through the uh through their site plan and everything with landscaping site plan. So what's different though is
3:15:02 correct me if I'm wrong our current code for commercial property which this would be does not require the new yard pattern book and the project that Miss Leam
3:15:11 you're leam also lader I'm lader ladner I apologize okay the the concern that Miss Ladner is
3:15:19 expressing is that we beautify the project consistent with that of Central Lake which would fall under the New Yard pattern book. So, I'm hearing that we
3:15:26 might want to see the landscaping plan in the site plan be consistent with the New York Pattern book residential
3:15:34 requirement, not our current code for commercial property. And I'm getting a bunch of head nods.
3:15:42 So, I I would say well, I know we got a bunch of ordinance and everything you got to follow on. I know we just updated our landscaping
3:15:49 code a little bit uh a few months ago, I think, if I'm not mistaken.
3:15:52 Only the residential. It doesn't apply to commercial. Well, the the commercial one here would be considered resolid row of shrubs. That's what's required per
3:16:00 code. And trees, it's uh three trees per 100 ft. That's what we they would have.
3:16:07 Yeah, that's not it. That's not going to do what she's looking for.
3:16:10 I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying that's what code is right now.
3:16:13 Yeah. It's it's going to be much less beautiful than what she's asking for.
3:16:17 Mr. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think because it's a church, I think they can still be uh considered residential,
3:16:23 right? Not not com uh commercial. You don't have to we can make that a condition.
3:16:28 I I are you ask well yes that that's true mayor. Um but I'm not sure what the zoning is.
3:16:37 Well a lot of churches that stay residential they keep listed residential because it's a little bit cheaper commercial easier. But you can still
3:16:45 apply conditions as you So I'm going to move to approve item number 19, resolution 2026-007
3:16:53 with the added condition that the property be compliant with our residential landscaping code adopting the New York pattern book plans and that it go by staff with those conditions.
3:17:02 All right, you could I need a second anyway. I don't know if I got one. Okay, I got a second. you can. So,
3:17:10 she's okay with the current shrubbery buffering trees on the east
3:17:16 side, which is between site area two and her home. It wasite.
3:17:25 Site three. Sorry. Three. Yes. No, you're okay with that. But I thought you said on SPA1.
3:17:34 That's where you have Yes. SP. Yes. SPA one is good. Good.
3:17:39 SPA3 is where she wanted. That's where she want to maintain all the of the uh the buffering and landscape and everything. Okay. And
3:17:47 of course two. Oh, you all going to put up a fence on two across the street, but it's going to remain grass. Yes. Okay.
3:17:55 So, it's no no paving on any of it. It's in and the site one area going to remain gravel.
3:18:05 So, I'll amend my motion to apply to areas three and one. Okay. Second.
3:18:13 All right. Do I have a second? Yes.
3:18:15 You amend it and another second. Okay. I have a motion in a second.
3:18:19 Uh in there. Are there any further question uh discussion here? I'll just add this.
3:18:26 I'll just add this, Mr. Mayor. I've known Bishop Forehand for 20 years and I find him to be an exceptional human being. just for your own as a
3:18:35 pastor. I just want you to know he's a quality human being and I believe he's going to do everything in his best interest or in the best interest of the community to do the right thing just for whatever that's worth.
3:18:46 And I I agree with him. I actually grew up with him. He's a little younger than me, but I used to work for his dad as well. And uh he's been doing great job in the community and like I can say I've
3:18:54 been wondering when they were going to do something because I know they they've outgrown the building. When I passed there on Sunday, I know they've outgrown the building they in already. Uh, and so
3:19:03 I was just a matter of time before they came and everything. So, uh, I have no further. Um, would I say we have a motion and a second? If there are no
3:19:10 further discussion, all in favor, let it be known by saying I. I.
3:19:15 All oppose. And the chair vote I as well. Motion passes 5.
3:19:23 Uh, item number 20. Uh, resolution number 2026-009.
3:19:32 A resolution of the city council of the city of Clermont, Lake County, Florida,
3:19:36 granting a conditional use permit to allow for a food truck to operate on an improved parcel located in the C2
3:19:43 general commercial zoning district providing for conflict, severability,
3:19:48 administrative correction of scrier's error, publication, and an effective date.
3:19:54 Yes, sir. Good evening, mayor, city council members, and guests. Nick Gonzalez Development Services.
3:20:02 The applicant adaptive provisions LLC is requesting a conditional use permit to allow the operation of a mobile food
3:20:09 dispensing vehicle on an improved parcel designated within the C2 General Commercial Zoning District. The proposed
3:20:16 location is at uh 1530 East Highway 50 within the Home Depot parking lot.
3:20:24 The food trailer is proposed to be located near the pro section of Home Depot on the east side of the facility positioned at least 10 ft from the
3:20:33 building. The placement will not impede the designated fire lane. The final location will be confirmed during site review to ensure compliance with all
3:20:42 applicable building and safet and fire safety codes. The food trail trailer will also require connection to electrical power from Home Depot for
3:20:50 which the applicant will obtain the ne necessary permits prior to installation and operation. Additionally, the applicant has indicated that a
3:20:59 contracted service provider will handle the collection and disposal of gray water and waste oil.
3:21:06 The applicant proposes to operate a single food trailer wall bers offering takeout service only. The use is intended to be familyfriendly in nature and will not involve alcohol service,
3:21:17 amplified entertainment, or late night operations. The proposed op hours of operations are 7 days a week, 8:00 a.m.
3:21:24 to 8:00 p.m. consistent with the Home Depot's business hours. The applicant has provided written authorization from Home Depot, allowing the use of the
3:21:33 property, including access to restroom facilities for patron and mop sinks for operational needs.
3:21:40 The city's land development code does not identify mobile food dispensing vehicles as a permitted use within the C2 general to commercial district. As
3:21:50 such, section 125-313 requires approval of a conditional use permit for this type of operation.
3:21:57 Although the C2 district permits restaurants and food establishments when conducted within an enclosed structure,
3:22:03 staff finds that the proposed use is compatible with the district and would not be more objectionable than any other permittable uses. Uh, additionally, due
3:22:11 to the recent food truck applications that we've received and uh, presented to planning and zoning commission and city council, uh, council has directed staff
3:22:20 to prepare an ordinance that would allow food trucks and trailers or any mobile food service operation meeting approved conditions to be permitted, eliminating the need for a conditional use permit.
3:22:30 Uh, this ordinance amendment will be brought forward to both planning and zoning commission and the city council for consideration at a future date.
3:22:40 When evaluating a request for a CUP, the land development code section 101-212 requires specific development standards
3:22:48 that are required to be met. Staff has reviewed the application as submitted in accordance in accordance accordance with development standards criteria and finds
3:22:57 a proposed use can meet general criteria for granting a conditional use permit.
3:23:03 The planning and zoning commission approved uh recommended approval 70 of resolution 2026-00009R
3:23:12 and staff recommends approval of the conditional permit conditional use permit with the conditions contained in resolution number 2026-009R.
3:23:21 And that concludes staff's presentation. Thank you. Is the applicant present?
3:23:40 Hi, my name is Briana and I'm the NSO manager for Wallberers Adaptive.
3:23:46 Good evening. My name is Eden. I'm our head of training and development for Adaptive.
3:23:51 So this evening we're here to present our idea for Excuse me. I'm just one sec. Can I get an address from one of you at least?
3:23:58 Yeah, of course. I actually am local kind of in Orlando at 661 Sable Lake Drive, Longwood, Florida. Thank you. Okay,
3:24:05 sorry about that.
3:24:07 So, we are here to present our idea to potentially bring our Wallberers concept to the Home Depot here in Clermont. We currently have four locations open. One
3:24:16 in Vieiraa, one in Vero Beach, one in Stewart, and one in Melbourne. That's our most recent open one. Um, we're
3:24:24 looking forward to potentially coming to the Clermont area since we focus mostly on growing developing areas. Um, our
3:24:31 primary focus is to bring job opportunity and a family-friendly environment to the communities that we serve. So, we're really excited and hopeful for the opportunity to come here.
3:24:42 Thank you. And we would be happy for any questions.
3:24:44 Yes, ma'am. If we have any questions, we will uh call you back at a later time.
3:24:49 Um, this is a public forum. Anyone in the
3:24:57 chamber wish to speak to I may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes. Yes, sir.
3:25:04 Good evening. I'm I'll keep this one brief. Uh Vincent Neim, Regency Hills.
3:25:09 This is the perfect example of a food truck. Okay, think about what I've been asking or what we've all been asking.
3:25:19 Does it meet the criteria? Gee, you got your lighting, you got your bathroom, you got your parking,
3:25:26 uh, sanitation,
3:25:28 and the best part, it don't have areas where they sit. It's not going to go against the fire code. And I can't wait
3:25:36 to see this new order in style coming up because this went beyond and above it.
3:25:43 Okay. It's not going to take the beautifification away from Clermont because it's already in a commercial
3:25:49 area and it is walkable when you're going into Home Depot. I got to tell you, when I first
3:25:58 I'm hungry right now. Okay. Been here almost 4 hours. No, but really think about it, people.
3:26:05 In New York, we have hot dog vendors and everything. Yep.
3:26:08 Okay. At least when I'm gonna spend thousands of dollars in the Home Depot, I want to treat myself to something.
3:26:15 Okay? So, please think about it real hard on approving this. Thank you and God bless you. And we're almost done.
3:26:24 This is a public forum. Anyone in the chamber wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and their address and have three minutes. Anyone else?
3:26:34 Anyone else? No one online. Okay, we're close to bring back the council. What say council? I'd like to approve it.
3:26:42 Okay. I have no problem with it. I have no problem. Okay. I'm excited. Okay.
3:26:48 I'm still I'm still waiting on waiting on the real ordinance because this is something we we talked about for some some years now allowing allowing places
3:26:56 like the Home Depot and public supermarkets and places like this to be able to put food trucks out here. We're just waiting on the ordinance. That's I would like to make all of the 90s
3:27:04 moms. Is there a chance one of the Wahberg brothers would be here for opening day?
3:27:10 not for opening day, but there is a chance they're coming out to Florida. Oh, okay. Well, that's good to know. Um,
3:27:17 I would like to make a motion to accept um item number 20, resolution number 2026-009R.
3:27:25 Second.
3:27:27 I have a motion and a second for approval of item number 20, resolution number 2026-009R.
3:27:34 Any further discussion? All in favor,
3:27:36 let it be known by saying I. I. All oppose. And the chair vote I as well. Motion passes 5. Good luck.
3:27:44 Thank you so much. Thank you. Welcome to Clermont.
3:27:46 And And when can I expect to see this at Home Depot? I go up there just about every day. We are shooting for miday. Midday. Yes.
3:27:55 Okay. Well, welcome. Thank you. Thank you.
3:27:58 Item number 21, resolution number 2026-014.
3:28:04 A resolution of the city council of the city of Clermont, Lake County, Florida,
3:28:09 authorizing budget amendments for the city of Clermont for fiscal year 2025 2026.
3:28:18 Scott Bore, finance director. Thank you,
3:28:20 mayor and city council. The budget, the proposed budget amendment before you is a single item issue item. It's a request from the police department to add uh
3:28:29 staffing requests, four additional sworn officers and four additional community service officers. Uh within the
3:28:36 resolution, you'll see the fiscal impact or the estimated fiscal impact for the remainder of the current fiscal year. In
3:28:43 a general fund, that being 482 $480,962 and in the police impact fund for the purchase of vehicles, $480,000.
3:28:53 And for the operational justification, I'll turn it over to Chief Gray. Okay.
3:29:01 Good evening, Mayor Council. Forgot the clicker. I apologize.
3:29:07 All right. There we go. I have a brief presentation. I will keep it brief and uh get through all the PowerPoints and try to get everybody out as quickly as
3:29:15 possible. The mission of the Clermont Police Department. This is a reminder to us of how and why we serve the community to enhance the quality of life in the city of Clermont by working
3:29:24 cooperatively with our community to enforce the law, prevent crime, and reduce fear. I focus on enforcing the law, preventing crime, and reducing
3:29:31 fear. And that's what this uh personnel request would do for us moving forward.
3:29:37 What you see here is a copy of our zone maps. We currently have eight zones. This works perfect. Green is zone one.
3:29:46 Orange is zone two. I'll use the pointer for the for the public out in the room. The dark purple is zone three,
3:29:54 four, five, six, seven, and then eight is all in gray. And that's how the city is laid out for the for the police department.
3:30:05 Our 90-day comparison stats. So what we do is we look at trends in a 90-day rolling 90 days rolling stats so that we
3:30:13 can look at trends and identify what's going on in in the past and how we're doing right now. As you look at the crimes there, you see we have been up in robberies in the last 90 days. However,
3:30:24 due to the hard work of the men and women of the Clermont Police Department, three of those suspects already in custody and we're working on the fourth. So you have a very motivated
3:30:32 and well-trained police staff that's taking care of business out on the streets. Uh, and you also see an an increase in the sex crimes and we're
3:30:40 working on that and identifying ways that we can be more efficient and address that more adequately. Those are known suspects, known victims. That's
3:30:48 not uh someone coming into town and snatching somebody off the trail and doing doing something wrong with them. That's not that. If you
3:30:56 look at the rest of the stats, you see significant decreases throughout autothefts, residential burglary, commercial burglary, vehicle burglary,
3:31:03 lararseny, and the grand total, I apologize, it's dark at the bottom. The grand total right now, we're down 15%.
3:31:09 When you look at two the comparison between the two quarters, that's a fantastic uh percentage right now. Now,
3:31:16 a wise chief once told me, if you're going to take credit when crime's down,
3:31:19 you have to be held accountable when crime's up, too. So, I expect to be held accountable if you see crime start to go into the positive numbers, but I don't
3:31:28 foresee that happening with the workforce we have.
3:31:33 The bullet points you see on the screen is what I will cover in the briefing that I have prepared for council. And then you there's a chart on the second.
3:31:44 I apologize on the third. This is all the bullet points that I'll cover here.
3:31:48 And then there's a chart with the factors and the impact on the staffing need. The city of Clermont continues to experience significant and sustained
3:31:55 growth. The 2020 census reported a population of 43,021 residents, while the Bureau of Economic and Business Research now estimates 51,042 residents.
3:32:06 A figure that to my knowledge does not include recent annexations or major upcoming developments such as McKinnon Groves, Ivy Ridge, completion of Wellness Ridge, Sanctuary,
3:32:17 the PY project, and the new Integra Heights apartment complex. This upward trend will continue to place increased demands on public safety services. As population grows, so do service demands.
3:32:30 Calls for service, community engagement,
3:32:31 and the complexity of policing responsibilities have all increased. In addition to traditional enforcement,
3:32:37 officers are increasingly addressing mental health issues, homelessness, and quality of life concerns. Transient populations, including our tourists,
3:32:46 seasonal residents, and commuters,
3:32:47 further impact service demand, but are not reflected in population counts.
3:32:53 Current staffing levels do not keep pace with this growth. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement recommends a staffing ratio of 2.29
3:33:02 to 2.51. And on the higher end, that's if you staff ports and if you staff schools,
3:33:10 officers per 10,000 residents. Clermont currently operates at a ratio of 1.88.
3:33:15 Adding four officers would improve this to 1.96, moving closer to recommended standards and better aligning resources with community needs. Historically, we
3:33:24 have staffed at a 2.0 ratio. That's what we have historically staffed. So, this this increase of four officers keeps us
3:33:32 right there at that 2.0. And I believe that's sustainable barring any huge uh changes in crime trends, historical
3:33:41 crime trends. When we look back at our data, while overall crime rates have declined, both property and violent crime remains a concern. Additional
3:33:49 staffing will allow the department to maintain progress while expanding proactive policing strategies. This includes precision policing, which uses
3:33:57 data-driven approaches to focus on emerging crime trends and deploy resources more effectively. Enhanced staffing will also improve patrol coverage and visibility.
3:34:07 More officers on the street means broader coverage, increased presence in neighborhoods, and greater ability to deter crime. It also allows for more
3:34:14 consistent services in areas that have been underserved due to staffing limitations such as downtown. I know uh I hear a lot about our beloved downtown
3:34:22 officers who we had to uh put elsewhere and I'm happy to say we should have a downtown officer here pretty quickly
3:34:31 within the next month or two. and in and the wellness way area. Community engagement will benefit as well. With
3:34:38 increased staffing, officers will have time to build relationships with residents and businesses, address concerns early, and strengthen trust.
3:34:46 This proactive approach helps prevent issues from escalating and supports long-term public safety concern outcomes. From an organizational
3:34:54 standpoint, additional staffing supports officer wellness and operational effectiveness. Reducing overtime and workload fatigue lowers the risk of
3:35:03 errors and burnout while improving morale and retention. It also ensures officers can attend necessary training without compromising daily service
3:35:11 levels, keeping the department aligned with best practices.
3:35:15 Recruitment and retention remain challenges nationwide, but Clermont has made strong progress through competitive wages supported by the city council.
3:35:23 Thank you. And the city manager, thank you. The department currently has four vacancies and continues to receive qualified applicants. Based on our
3:35:32 current hiring trends, we are confident in our ability to fill both existing vacancies and four additional positions by the end of this calendar year.
3:35:41 Overall, this request for the additional officers is not simply about increasing personnel. It's about ensuring the police department can continue to meet
3:35:48 the needs of growing and evolving community while maintaining high standards of service, safety, and professionalism.
3:36:00 Really excited to introduce the community service program, the community service officers program, something that the police department has been working on for a couple years. We haven't gotten
3:36:09 it across the finish line. I hope this evening that we receive uh that extra nudge to get us across the finish line.
3:36:16 Um once again, the bullet points will cover what I'm going to go over. I didn't want to bore you with words on the PowerPoint.
3:36:26 Currently, sworn officers are often required to respond to a wide range of incidents, including many non-emergency situations that do not necessitate the
3:36:35 presence of an armed officer with full arrest powers. Assigning sworn officers to handle tasks such as minor traffic crashes, parking enforcement, abandoned
3:36:44 vehicle reports, lost or found property reports, and directing traffic diverts their time and focus from higher priority calls, proactive policing efforts, and critical incident response.
3:36:55 Community service officers are uniformed, nonsworn civilian employees specifically trained to handle a variety
3:37:02 of non-emergency calls for service and support functions. The addition of a community service officer program would allow us to optimize sworn deployment by
3:37:11 freeing up sworn officers to focus on emergency calls, criminal investigations, proactive patrols, and community policing initiatives. It will
3:37:20 also allow us to provide a more timely response to non-emergency calls. A community service officer can be dispatched specifically for these
3:37:27 incident incidents, reducing weight times for residents needing assistance with issues like minor accidents or parking complaints.
3:37:36 If the if the patrol officers are busy right now and a parking complaint comes in, that is considered a low priority call.
3:37:44 They could wait 30, 40 minutes if if we are busy out on the road. The ability to have the CSOS there and answer that call
3:37:51 for service within a shorter time period greatly assists the community.
3:37:57 It'll also allow us to streamline the handling of routine reports and tasks,
3:38:01 improving the the overall workflow and productivity of the department. They can handle initial report writing for specific non-violent crimes, gather
3:38:09 information, and manage traffic control at accident scenes, school zones, or special events. They provide an additional visible presence presence in
3:38:17 the community assisting citizens and contributing to a sense of safety and service. They can also assist with community outreach programs and events.
3:38:28 Utilizing community service officers for appropriate tasks is a more coste effective approach than assigning sworn officers considering differences in
3:38:36 salary benefits and training requirements. This allows the department to expand its service capabilities responsibly within budget considerations.
3:38:46 Community service officers will be held to similar physical fitness standards as police officers to ensure they maintain operational readiness and continue to
3:38:54 meet the minimum requirements of their job description.
3:38:57 A community service officer program also creates a valuable recruiting pipeline by offering individuals a structured hands-on in introduction to law
3:39:06 enforcement without the immediate commitment of becoming a law enforcement officer. It also allows those who may lack experience or feel uncertain about
3:39:13 entering the profession to build confidence, develop practical skills,
3:39:18 and gain firsthand exposure to police operations.
3:39:21 Over time, the experience helps identify and prepare motivated candidates who are better informed, more capable, and more
3:39:29 committed when they choose to pursue a career as a sworn police officer.
3:39:34 The addition of four community service officers represents, in my opinion, a forward-thinking investment in the safety and well-being of the Clermont
3:39:41 community. It allows the police department to adapt to the demands of a growing city by implementing a proven,
3:39:48 efficient, coste effective model for service delivery.
3:39:53 This initiative will result in enhanced resource allocation, improve response times across all call types, increase
3:40:00 capacity for proactive policing by sworn personnel, and enhanced services to our residents.
3:40:07 At this time, I'll take any questions that the council may have. All righty, sir. I tell you what, chief.
3:40:15 Let me open this up to the public and if we have any other any question, we will call you back at a later time. But this is a public form. Anyone in the public
3:40:24 in the chamber wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address and have three minutes.
3:40:35 Joe Famasi 2693 jump way. Uh I appreciate the police department's efforts here to maintain a fullervice
3:40:43 police department at the same time worrying about the cost and trying to uh make it more efficient. I think that
3:40:52 this is an outstanding program. I've lived in communities where community service officers have been involved.
3:40:57 They provide a valuable service. At the same time, they maintain the police department's normal routine services at
3:41:05 a higher level as well as response for emergencies. Also, I appreciate that this department is thinking about their
3:41:13 officers and trying to reduce ways for their officers having lots of stress.
3:41:19 Stress related cause injuries. Injuries cause officers to be off. So for a police department to focus on the mental
3:41:27 health of their staff and to take that into priority, that's amazing. That takes good leadership. I hope that you will pass this. I think that this is
3:41:35 going to affect the city of Clermont majorly in a positive way. Uh we complain about traffic all the time and
3:41:43 traffic accidents and those kind of things. Having that resource to be able to dispatch quicker to accidents, minor
3:41:50 accidents, can maintain even smaller accidents from turning into bigger accidents. So, I'd like to thank the
3:41:58 chief, his staff, and the police department, and the men and women that are serving under him for coming up with this program. Thank you.
3:42:06 Thank you.
3:42:14 Good evening, city council Vincent Regency Hills. That was a really good presentation, okay? And it brought back
3:42:23 memories being a retired law enforcement from New York City. I will just give you my experience of being an officer in New York City.
3:42:32 When we are under manpower, we're overworked. And when we're overworked, we might make bad decisions,
3:42:40 okay? But you cannot make a bad decision when there's bad guys out there, okay?
3:42:47 Because not only is your life on the line, but it's also the citizens of Clermont. I could look in everybody's eyes right now and I don't have to say
3:42:55 no more. All right? Because you know the import of our first responders, especially our police officers,
3:43:03 okay? They say firemen's run into the line of fire. Well, these officers, and not that I'm favoring police over fire
3:43:12 department, they're both respected, but they're running into the bullets. Okay?
3:43:18 So, please vote with your heart and your mind on this one. It's a no-brainer. God bless you.
3:43:25 Thank you. Anyone else?
3:43:34 Paula Hoisington, 564 East Dninnesota Street. I just want to echo everything that the two gentlemen just spoke um
3:43:41 regarding this initiative. I commend the chief for being a visionary for seeing this, foreseeing this and wanting to
3:43:50 improve. I mean, I think we have the best police department around, so this can only enhance. And I agree with the
3:43:58 gentleman that just spoke, the both of them. I hope that you will think with your heart what's in the best interest of this city and do what the chief has
3:44:07 requested. Find the money, whatever we need to do so that we can enhance this program and enhance this department.
3:44:13 Thank you, chief, for having vision.
3:44:16 Thank you. Anyone else? There's a public forum. Anyone in the chamber wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and
3:44:24 address and have three minutes. Anyone else? Seeing no one else. Anyone online?
3:44:31 No one online. We will close public comment. Bring it back to council. What say council? Well, well, nothing for me. It's a no-brainer. So,
3:44:41 I want to approve it. That's where I'm at.
3:44:43 I'd like to make a motion to approve item number 2026-01. I second.
3:44:49 Okay. I have a motion. and a second for approval of um resolution number 2026-014R.
3:44:58 Any further discussion?
3:45:00 I do feel the need to um I know that this is going to pass and I just
3:45:07 want to caution any council from getting from and respectfully from thinking with
3:45:15 our hearts. Um it's we're talking about a $1 million commitment to the budget
3:45:23 for 2027 and we haven't gone through the budget process yet. So I I want to be careful that we don't set a precedence
3:45:31 of saying well it's public safety so they get whatever they ask for. I've spent a great deal of time with chief and I just want to frame this for us in
3:45:40 a way that I can be held accountable that chief can be held accountable and that uh Mr. Van Wagner can be held accountable.
3:45:49 The first is we've had four open seats for this year that were funded. So the addition of four new seats of full-time officers actually has a net zero on our budget for fiscal year 2026.
3:46:01 I like the community service officers program in that it helps us transition into the growth that we're expecting with the annexations that will likely
3:46:10 hit our budget in 27. But I think we need to be prepared for the ask to come for 27 for additional officers. I'm also
3:46:18 mindful that since 2022, we've never actually had a fully staffed police department. So, nobody in the police
3:46:25 department and nobody on this council has experience with having a fully staffed police department. We actually don't know what it looks like and how it
3:46:33 feels when it is fully staffed, which can be both a blessing and a curse. So,
3:46:37 I want to be careful with how we're approaching morale, public service, the way that we interact with the public and
3:46:46 with each other as we go through this process. I do want to reiterate at least something we had talked about
3:46:55 when we went through the budget last year of having the standard of being the safest city in Florida. And I think that what chief is presenting speaks to that.
3:47:05 uh finance is doing their part, fire is doing their part, public works is doing their part, and I think that this goes towards that goal, but I do want to
3:47:14 continue to hold the police to that standard of h having the safest city in Florida. And the third thing we've talked about at several council meetings
3:47:22 as of late has been that July 1st date that we've asked fire and finance to come to us with a five-year plan for how we execute the six-minute response time,
3:47:33 you know, for all citizens in Clermont.
3:47:36 And I've asked chief and I want to speak to you that I've asked chief to be part of that conversation with fire, with
3:47:42 finance, and with public works so that we're looking at this from the lens of how do we make Clermont the safest city
3:47:49 in Florida. Um, so I approached this with temperance and and I made a comment at a previous meeting that I felt this
3:47:57 was premature. I have since learned that we actually have 10 officers or 10 persons in the queue taking the test.
3:48:04 So, this is actually something that can be executed rather quickly. Um, so that's good. Um, but I do want to make
3:48:12 sure we're continuing to work together and communicate and and not get wrapped up in the excitement of it because it is a massive financial commitment by the
3:48:21 citizens. And I want to make sure we're giving it that respect. That's all I wanted to say. I understand every point. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it.
3:48:29 I appreciate it. Anyone else?
3:48:31 I think we've given a lot of respect to them. I for you to say like you said in 2022 it's been that long since they've been fully staffed and we've staffed our
3:48:40 fire department but we haven't staffed our police and I think it's time to give the money to the police department.
3:48:47 Well, we did they couldn't fill it. That was the issue. It it wasn't underfunded.
3:48:51 It was they couldn't find the officers to staff it.
3:48:53 Well, and I guess that's one of the reasons I have no problem with this.
3:48:57 We've always promised the police department if they ever can man uh staff their police department. I at least that one of my promise I'll be happy to
3:49:05 authorize physicians. So I have no problem with it. And as Miss Mario say we have no problem in the past few weeks our council member um authorizing and
3:49:15 committing to next year's budget for the fire department to keep us safe. So, I think we need to do the same thing with our police department as I know for a
3:49:23 fact that uh yes, crime is rising as you saw in some of the stats out there. And I've always been very big fan of community policing.
3:49:33 Yeah.
3:49:34 Okay. And so to me, I think that's that's one of the main steps in helping reduce crime in our neighborhoods and everything. and and I was a witness of a
3:49:43 couple things incident just happened and I was very shocked and amazed at the same time that actually some of the community uh
3:49:52 residents actually helped the police department out and that come from the presence of community policing that we do have out there. So to increase it
3:50:00 would be a great thing. So I'm all for it. So yes,
3:50:02 can we vote? If I may interject, I feel like I have to say something as the police chief. When we talk about staffing,
3:50:11 our staffing is different from the fire department staffing, right?
3:50:14 Like I don't want the police department to be the lightning rod for anything coming down. The fire department was able to fill their vacancies. We
3:50:22 weren't. And whether that's because of societal issues or because of recruiting or whatever it was, that that was the case.
3:50:31 The new version of the police department is committed to filling all of those vacancies. Good.
3:50:36 May 8th, we have 10 pe the week of May 8th, we have 10 people going through the testing. I think that's a Friday. That's good.
3:50:43 It's like there's a chance that's a it's a rare chance that everybody passes, but if everybody passed, I just filled all the vacancies and two csos. Yeah. Just like that.
3:50:52 Yes. If I could add this too, Mr. Mayor.
3:50:56 Yeah. and for the council. You guys were part of the solution to making the police department have the staffing we need.
3:51:03 So, I can't say thank you enough to all of you who voted cuz part of our issue was a pay issue. Right.
3:51:10 And soon as we corrected that, that wasn't a problem anymore like it was. And they've been filling positions. So,
3:51:17 I just want to say publicly thank you to the council that did that. So, you you helped us take care of that problem.
3:51:24 That was part of the problem filling those seats. We had people that were paying higher wages in the area
3:51:31 and it was just very difficult. So I don't dis I don't have any problem with their recruiting after looking at it. I think it was a pay issue and it's
3:51:39 evident just because after you did that things have turned around drastically and they did they did some signing bonuses as well and things just started
3:51:48 to turn around rapidly. So, I just want to publicly thank the council for their support of the police department and that's why I believe one of the reasons
3:51:56 it's turned around in recruitment and and I agree with that and I just think I'm just thankful this time when we gave the pay pay increase all the
3:52:04 other agencies didn't try it out right cuz that wasn't the first time we did that you know last time first time we
3:52:11 did it uh the next day everybody else jumped up up above us that part I just think the other agencies couldn't do it we was in a a
3:52:20 place financially that we could give him and keep them keep keep them out. Okay.
3:52:24 If it puts anybody's mind at ease, a bunch of those agencies are negotiating contracts this year. Our contract not so so yeah. Well, we know we just gave our did contract last year.
3:52:35 We up for another year or so. But we got another year to worry about it. But as I said, I want to make sure I keep my promise. Even on the old chief, we
3:52:42 always said I always promise him if he ever if he ever can get his manning up,
3:52:46 I'll be first one to authorize new positions and everything, get it feel something. I have no problem with what we doing.
3:52:53 If I may, um I what I what I want to I want to go back to our last meeting when we talked about uh funding for fire as
3:53:02 well. And the reason why I asked my fellow council members to have this conversation collectively as public
3:53:10 safety is because what I don't want to do is create this narrative or situation that um we're pitting
3:53:18 perceivedly or uh actually our two public safety entities against each other
3:53:26 with regard to staffing and funding and resources because they do work hand in
3:53:32 hand to make Clermont safe. And I think both the chiefs fully understand and
3:53:39 their command staff fully understand and work with their employees and their staff and personnel to fully understand that at the end of the day, there is
3:53:47 only so much money in the pot available to fund the services that we provide.
3:53:54 Um, but you know, I also think we have an obligation. We have a police
3:54:00 department here today and I'm glad we're I'm I'm really glad we're we're funding this because I was worried that we weren't going to and I'm glad it sounds
3:54:09 like it's going to be a unanimous vote because we we are spending money in areas of where we hope to provide a
3:54:17 service and we've allocated quite a few dollars to do so and and we didn't have the conversation of what also those
3:54:26 dollars might be able to be utilized for for services today, for departments that exist today. Um, and I hope that we will
3:54:35 continue to move in a direction where we talk about public safety collectively so that we're not even creating the
3:54:42 narrative that it's one department's favored over the other or one's more important over the other because they
3:54:50 both provide a valuable invaluable service to our community. And I'm incredibly um uh res I have an incredible amount of
3:54:59 respect for our chief today for um bringing forward the vision of the community service program. I remember
3:55:06 reading one of the very first articles that you were interviewed in after you were uh named chief. And one of the
3:55:14 things that you said was you see this as a catalyst for us as a community to provide a better service both from a
3:55:22 sworn law enforcement perspective but also a service to our community in ways that don't require a sworn officer to be
3:55:31 there but still provide the same expectation and level of service by a CPD officer and somebody who encompasses
3:55:40 those those five values that make up CPD. So, um I I I am very happy to see
3:55:48 us move forward with this and I look forward to us hopefully having a more collective conversation about public safety so that we don't create perceived
3:55:57 or actual narratives of department funding versus department funding um in in the narrative out there. Thank you.
3:56:08 No. Okay. Well, I have a motion and a second on at all, didn't you?
3:56:12 Y for approval of uh item number 21, resolution number 2026-014R.
3:56:21 There's no further discussion. All in favor, let it be number by saying I. I. All oppose and chair vote I as well.
3:56:28 Motion passes 50. Item number 22, city. Thank you for your continued support.
3:56:35 Yes, sir. Thank you, Chief.
3:56:42 Item number 22, city manager the evaluation criteria.
3:56:47 All right. So, thank thank you mayor and council. So, back in March 17th of this year at the council workshop, the council gave direction for Naen, myself,
3:56:57 and Christian to work on preparing a draft manager evaluation. I think you guys called it a uh give you a big polar clay that you could mold down into something. Mhm.
3:57:06 So um that you also directed us to use the charter criteria as the basis for the evaluation and and include maybe
3:57:15 some additional stuff. So what we did is we prepared for you a draft clay mold clay to mold that basically
3:57:24 has two sections to it. The first section is solely based on the charter and how the charter criteria is. Now, we have it set up currently as a one to
3:57:33 five scale. That's obviously up for discretion and discussion. The second part is some criteria that we found
3:57:41 looking at other jurisdictions kind of some of the best best type of evaluating criterias for a city manager. So, what
3:57:49 we're looking for is direction now on the draft criteria so we can modify and finalize it the the city manager
3:57:56 evaluation form and bring it back to you at an upcoming meeting for finalization if you want. Uh we're also seeking
3:58:04 direction on the council's desired evaluation process, how you want to do it. There's several different ways to do it. Uh one that's very common is that
3:58:12 each council member fill out the evaluation, hand it to the city clerk.
3:58:16 The city clerk then compiles it, puts together kind of an average, and then at the next public hearing, you guys discuss it and and openly discuss how
3:58:24 you want to rate the city manager as well as any compensation if if that's to your choosing. So, there's a lot of different ways to do it. We're just
3:58:32 seeking direction so we can kind of finalize this and get it moving forward for you.
3:58:38 Well, first of all, I think this is you did a great job in in putting this all together in such short notice. I I would think this is, you know, the way it looks right now to me,
3:58:49 it seems adequate, if not perfect in what we need to really do. So, I don't know what what what you're seeking from us as a as a vote to to move it forward.
3:58:59 Is that what you're looking for?
3:59:00 Well, if there's any if there's any edits, if there's any deletions or additions that you want to add in there,
3:59:07 Well, we can always do that later. I mean, I like what you have in here.
3:59:11 I think it's really well done. and I appreciate it. I think this is really great work. Um, taking the feedback that we gave.
3:59:18 Um, it's nice to have something that we're evaluating the city manager by.
3:59:22 So, we started with nothing and now we have something. Um, I like that it's rooted in the charter and I I'm thinking
3:59:29 section two kind of came from Naen the interactive skills. Maybe I'm wrong, but I do like No. All right. So, whoever it came from, I love it. And and I think
3:59:38 the standards are really good. The only edit that jumped out at me, and maybe if I find tooth comb it, I could find something else, but the one that jumped
3:59:46 out at me, um, under section six policy execution,
3:59:50 um, not the blue letters, but implements council's actions in accordance with the intent of council. I would ask that we
4:00:00 clarify that to say something to the effect of as publicly communicated by council versus maybe conversations that
4:00:08 were had that weren't in public or that weren't a majority of council. So, I think that that would be good for both the city manager and also the public
4:00:16 when it comes to him um executing the intent of council. Other than that, I thought it was uh
4:00:24 I thought it was really well done. And I'd be prepared to say, "Let's make it final." Yeah.
4:00:30 And Yeah.
4:00:31 Yeah. I I I actually I I went back and looked at I I think a resident spoke at the meeting and also emailed us all about the Florida City County City and
4:00:40 County Managers Association. And I don't know if Mr. Matthysse if you guys used the samples on there. It it actually it
4:00:47 actually there's a lot of mirroring of there. Um they they have some kind of I think they have three variations on
4:00:55 their website of what you can do. Um and I I'm not I'm not married to the fact that this has to be what we do every
4:01:03 year. I think it is just going back to uh Council Member Myers, you were first elected in 23.
4:01:12 Yes. So I think we talked about this in 23. Uh and so I don't know how any other conversations and I wasn't on the
4:01:20 council at the time so there was no, you know, wasn't a conversation we were having that way. Um but uh you know we talked about that and I think councils have talked about it in some way, shape
4:01:28 or form since then and we've never even gotten to this point. So I think it's important for us to at least have a foundation for this year. We owe it to
4:01:38 whomever is sitting in that seat and right now that's Mr. Van Wagner to we owe it to him to for him to understand where we think he's performing well,
4:01:49 what we would like to see him do better, what we would like to see him do new.
4:01:54 Um, and provide a basis for the vision for moving forward in that direction.
4:02:00 Um, and we're going to go through this the first time and then we'll probably say, "All right, we got to tweak a few things. That didn't quite make sense."
4:02:05 And I think if we're all okay doing that, um, we use the resources, we modify this, but this is rooted in our charter, which actually the other
4:02:13 examples maybe they were, but they didn't explicitly say that. Uh, and I think that's really cool that we're doing that, that we're saying that look,
4:02:20 we're actually pulling this from our charter. Um,
4:02:24 with regard to uh potential timeline and so forth, um, I do think it's uh, good for us to each individually fill it out when it comes time. Uh, sub submit them,
4:02:37 have them evaluated, have a have a an average placed out there. Um, and then we we get that back and then we discuss
4:02:47 it and move forward. I don't know what timeline works the best. the ones I saw on on the that website, that managers association website, they referred to
4:02:55 October and November. Um, part of me thinks that m maybe January, February is
4:03:02 a better time because that's once a a council election occurs and they're kind of moving that for the next direction,
4:03:08 you can set those tones for the the the following budget year cycle that would come up that May, June, July. Um, so I I
4:03:17 mean I'm open, but I think uh we have a good start here and I'm really really proud of us doing that to get to this
4:03:26 point and thank um the the three folks who were intimately involved with bringing this forward.
4:03:33 Oh, I'd like to add I would encourage us to do July and January with the reason being that July is when we go through
4:03:40 budget. And so if there is a conversation about a pay increase or adjustment, it seems like factoring that into the budget for the coming year would be prudent. Um and then January,
4:03:51 to your point, Mr. survey about okay there's an election maybe there's a different perception but January also gives whatever new council members there
4:03:58 might be a good 6 to 8 weeks of working with that person before they let their perception as a public member color
4:04:05 their potential evaluation of the city manager because that's only one piece of 14 question 15 questions so if something
4:04:14 like that sounds good to everybody if I had to pick one I would pick July so that it factors into the budget Um, but
4:04:23 I see the wisdom of your July, January and July to do it twice.
4:04:28 I don't I don't I hear what you're saying. I don't know if I want to do two times a year. I just don't think it I think an annual review is is more
4:04:36 appropriate. Um, I think if we do it at July, that makes sense because we could allocate otherwise we, you know, we can
4:04:43 allocate a a a maximum percentage I guess in the process and if it gets implemented, great. If not, it gets returned back. We're not talking
4:04:51 significant, you know, millions of dollars here. Um, so I I I think preference-wise, I'd rather just do once a year.
4:05:01 Yeah. I mean, I I would think January is good. Like you said, this a new council is in, they could then evaluate for three months as opposed to to July. I
4:05:10 think you might have predispositions. I think it'll be, you know, this way that,
4:05:14 you know, you're really thinking that the public is going to be doing because let's say new people get elected, they might say, well, we I don't like Bill,
4:05:22 so let's get Bill out, you know, so this way January it would be a nice thing to do and then you would get a fresh evaluation in.
4:05:30 Well, I'm more in time to go to September myself with it once a year in September. And I I don't like January because you changing if you change
4:05:38 council over in November, that only give him a month or so to be here working with him. And that new council member,
4:05:44 he'll be too busy trying to figure out what he's doing uh he or she is doing than to worry about what what the evaluation of a city manager is and
4:05:51 everything. So, I would like to see at least 6 months down the road uh from from November, whatever. But I'm thinking more like September uh to give
4:06:00 them almost the new council member almost a full year and everybody else on there a full year. And of course um if
4:06:07 we decide to I don't know we hadn't talked about it if we decided to put any stipulation for pay raises or anything
4:06:14 increase in pay and everything with that then make it effective you do it in September October whatever and then you make it effective with a pay raise in January. Okay.
4:06:23 I can get to terms on September. I would just ask that it be done before the final budget is adopted so that you're making that decision with the final budget m meeting.
4:06:32 So if it starts in August and goes to September.
4:06:34 So maybe August September then because we we I think don't we approve in the second the second that second hearing is in like mid October mid September, right?
4:06:43 It's like the fourth week of September. Yeah.
4:06:45 So maybe we because they have it if you look on their on that website you'll see that they do it like at the first meeting October they they it gets presented out the second meeting
4:06:54 is the deadline for completion and then that first meeting in November is when they actually do it. So maybe we have to do August for those
4:07:02 two and then that first meeting in September is the actual evaluation.
4:07:07 I think it's logical to do it during the budget process. Otherwise you're either approving a raise or you're not approving a raise and then the next month you're doing the evaluation. That just doesn't make sense.
4:07:16 Yeah.
4:07:16 Yeah. And and you can we can absolutely do that. We can get it to you in early August and have it due back to us by September 1st. So we we can compile the
4:07:24 information and have it to you on the agenda, that first agenda in September.
4:07:27 Yeah, you can you can always you can always say your policy is, hey, we're going to do a 3% increase or three 3%
4:07:34 merit and always have that built into into your budget or whatever. Of course,
4:07:38 if it don't man out, then he just doesn't get it.
4:07:41 That's true, too. you know, a lot of ways to do that. So, yeah.
4:07:45 Do we have to do any kind of official action? Uh, Mr. Wah. Yes. Okay.
4:07:49 Um, in other words, it sounds like the express policy would be to adopt these criteria. And if you do,
4:07:55 I think you should vote to um approve these as the evaluation criteria. Uh maybe we didn't prepare a resolution for
4:08:05 it, but really it should be a resolution.
4:08:07 Okay. Um, so maybe what I'd be asking to bring a resolution back at the next meeting with this information with the timeline we've discussed
4:08:16 in the next meeting and maybe we can outline the procedure in the same thing. Okay. All right.
4:08:22 We go ahead and uh your amendment. Is everyone okay with my amendment? Huh?
4:08:26 Is is everyone okay with my amendment that his responsibility is to execute the public? That's fine. Oh, opinion of council. That's fine. We can correct.
4:08:35 No, it wasn't. So, we're not voting on anything.
4:08:37 The city manager brought up that there may be public comment and I I was just saying Yeah. Yeah. Oops. Oh, yeah. Sorry.
4:08:43 But, u if this is a public form, anyone in the public wish to address this item may come to the microphone and state your name and address. They have three minutes.
4:09:01 Joe from 2693 jumpy jackway. Uh I just had a question about this on this particular thing. Is there a rebuttal
4:09:10 for the uh city manager to respond to whatever your evaluation is?
4:09:17 You know that does he have an official place where he could rebut anything, you know, or thank you for his evaluation?
4:09:26 So I think that it's only fair that it's a two-way street. Well,
4:09:31 I personally I don't think it's any problem with me anyway. If we do eval we do evaluation, if he want to sit down oneonone with me with his evaluation,
4:09:39 I'm always happy to and everything. So,
4:09:42 but I hear what you're saying that we built in to the criteria uh a rebuttal.
4:09:47 Uh I if if the city manager evaluation is on an agenda, the city manager has a right to be heard. It already says he
4:09:55 can participate in the discussions. So to that end, I think it's already built in if you put it on the agenda.
4:10:02 Yeah, it's already pretty much I would say think so. Anyway, it's built in.
4:10:06 So my question is is you're saying that these would not be open to the public to view or
4:10:13 Oh, no. They these valuation sheets will be public records.
4:10:16 Okay. Well, and that's why I was thinking that the city manager should have a chance for rebuttal in writing. Oh, in writing. Yes.
4:10:23 Well, he has that option, too. I think nothing prevents him from okay uh writing you know a 60page response at the
4:10:32 I just think it's only fair you know I mean if you're going to put it in writing that you give him a chance to respond to that officially well I guess what I looked at from a
4:10:41 military I used to do a performance report they give it to me and of course if I wanted to go and I didn't have a official rebuttal but I can always go to
4:10:48 my supervisor and ask could we talk about it at at the end and everything and they say yeah and nay you Most time they allowed us to talk. So yeah,
4:10:58 but but uh but I to me that's only only respectful. If I write something, you
4:11:05 want to talk about it, I have no problem with them coming back and talking to me.
4:11:08 But official rebuttal in in a performance report, I don't think I've ever Well, that's an HR issue, right? Yeah.
4:11:16 At that point, we're falling into whatever HR would is. Am I wrong? No.
4:11:21 I mean, personally, I don't think so. I mean, I I think the city manager is a charter officer, right?
4:11:26 And I think it it's this isn't something that's going in the personnel policy or manual. This is something that's direct
4:11:33 between y'all and the city manager. And really, the point of this is just to outline, I think, through a resolution
4:11:40 your criteria and the process. But I think it's always built in that uh a city manager can write whatever he wants
4:11:49 and he can participate in the discussion. So, no city manager is ever going to be left out of this process in terms of responding or discussing. And I
4:11:58 mean, I don't know if you have feedback on that, but I don't I don't think he's left out.
4:12:02 Think of an extreme. The truth of the matter is, you know, we could do an evaluation. And if three of us find he's totally at fault
4:12:09 in in a lot of areas, we can voice that as, you know, dismiss him for cause without cause.
4:12:17 Well,
4:12:17 well, in that case, the charter actually has a I was just going to say there is a procedure for um terminating your city
4:12:24 manager. It does normally require a public hearing and some notice um you know, unless you can come to some kind of agreement or something like that. So,
4:12:34 so let's just incorporate that into the resolution just to restate it.
4:12:37 Obviously, we don't have to, but I think for purposes of addressing the concerns,
4:12:42 if there was a negative a termination for cause situation, there is actually some pretty solid protections in the charter for the city manager.
4:12:52 In many ways, that's adverse to the public's interest. Right.
4:12:56 Well, I just like to say u chance for feedback or rebutt whether it's negative or positive. Okay. Either way, he can do
4:13:04 he has that opportunity. Okay. I mean and and so in section 32 of the charter subsection five it says attend all that
4:13:12 city manager may attend all meetings of the city council and of its committees and keep the council advised of the activities of his office with the right to take part in the discussions but
4:13:21 without having a vote and so that's why I'm saying I think it's there okay I refer to it yes ma'am Paulington 564 east of Sodto Street um
4:13:30 commend the staff for putting this together it was discussed in 23 it was discussed in 24.
4:13:36 It's been unfair to Mr. Van Wagner to have to work and not know what the expectations are. Um, so I thank you. I
4:13:44 thank you. Um, it's it's been unfair for him to work 16 months and not have any type of written guidance of what the
4:13:52 expectations are of him as a city manager. So, thank you all for developing a process and getting to this point. Good luck.
4:14:06 Thank you. Anyone else? Anyone else? Where's Wallberers?
4:14:12 Seeing no one else. See no one else. I close the chamber. Anyone online?
4:14:16 No. And what say council? Uh, we have a motion and a I think we have consensus and we're bringing it back as a resolution.
4:14:23 That's correct. Okay. All right. So, we good to go. Yes. Do we need to direct for a resolution? I'm fine.
4:14:30 Let's move on to report. Mr. Van Wagner, I I'm only going to share one thing.
4:14:37 Mrs. Hoisington asked her question about the city manager search and I've communicated with staff while I've been
4:14:44 up here. Procurement has no idea about this vendor and Scott also shared with me from finance that no payments have
4:14:52 been made to this vendor also. So we as a employees, we don't know anything about this.
4:14:58 So yeah, thank you. But we still need Mr. and get with the uh chief and everything. Let's let's let's see if we
4:15:05 we have some stolen identity or whatever's going on out there, please. Sir, that ends my report. Mr. Mayor, thank thank you. Uh Mr. Wah,
4:15:15 uh we are currently working on several proposed ordinances for your consideration. I mean, some have been discussed tonight. Um, one is uh about
4:15:24 ebikes that is coming up soon um for your consideration. One is regarding
4:15:33 increased notices for certain applications with planning. Um I think there's one that we may have to do based
4:15:40 on new legislation and um anyways you'll be seeing those.
4:15:45 Uh in terms of litigation we do have some various claims. So, just so you know, we we probably get sued in
4:15:54 foreclosures once a month or something like that. And the reason it's our utility bills, you know, a lot of times we're dragged in as
4:16:01 a necessary defendant, but we we will file something just to preserve our claim, but we don't actively litigate those. There's nothing really for us to
4:16:09 do. Um, we also are dragged into a lot of bankruptcies. So, large corporations uh petition for bankruptcy protection.
4:16:16 They may have utility bills and other things. Again, it's not something we actively um really litigate. So, um I think that concludes my report.
4:16:26 Thank you, sir. Mr. Peterson,
4:16:30 uh I've been getting multiple calls from citizens about the the loud music here and I don't know if you've gotten
4:16:37 similar calls. I did address it with the police chief and also with uh Kurt about what kind of regulations are in place
4:16:46 and you know they said that they would moderate it a little bit more maybe to appease the people that are in town that are getting abused but the other side
4:16:54 was he said so far he's only gotten two complaints about music so which is kind of puzzling if it's if
4:17:01 it's that drastic but at any rate you know I wanted to address that you know because I I think it's important if you live in town,
4:17:09 especially if you have some kind of situations where you you want to really be at peace with yourself. Yeah.
4:17:16 Well, I'm not I'm not sure where where your complaints coming from. Citizens in town. In town here. In town here. Yeah.
4:17:23 Close to where the the bars are and stuff like that. And you know, I think we have an ordinance in place after 11 you have to curtail music. Is that correct?
4:17:32 It's 10 o'clock. 10. 10. Okay. 10 o'clock. Even better. Uh well, it's 11 on Friday and Saturday. Okay. and Saturday. But keep in mind,
4:17:40 keep in mind also downtown in this downtown area, they're not supposed to be using amplified music.
4:17:46 Well, they can have it inside the building. I think the question that was addressed is if they're allowed to use external speakers and then I think maybe
4:17:54 to, you know, some of them have these garage doors that can open up and that would then take their internal speakers and and turn them into external
4:18:02 speakers. Yeah. So, I mean, uh, if we had more than than the two complaints, I would think maybe that would that would address it, but maybe maybe we'll see
4:18:11 what's happening next week or as as summer comes in. But it's summer in Florida all the time. So, and Chief Lee,
4:18:18 yeah, the chief's not here right now to address any of those.
4:18:20 We Kirk, do uh uh do they still have the chief uh police department still have the desk the guns and everything that they carry with them and everything? No.
4:18:30 So they do have guns that we purchased for them a few years ago that they can go on the scene and take I think but the problem is is that you know if you're there and it's blasting
4:18:37 loud and then you know a half hour later it's off.
4:18:41 So you know Yeah. Mr. Peterson brought that to my attention and we talked all of us together about that. So you know he didn't direct the staff just so
4:18:50 everybody knows but also chief was already talking to those com those businesses downtown. he was
4:18:59 being very proactive and warning them that this is starting to get out of hand and let them know that they will be monitoring the sound levels. Just so you
4:19:07 know that that's taken place since our conversation on Monday. Okay.
4:19:11 Okay. And then the other thing is you know we've got you know there was that press release that Clermont is 19th in the nation for traffic and you you know
4:19:19 you want to kind of address that what we're doing now as council and I think we're being very proactive in that we hired DPZ.
4:19:28 So DPZ is is going to like look into more practices as far as you know traffic. We've you know we're going to
4:19:35 have that new road and independence way and the new traffic that'll alleviate 50 maybe because we'll be able to take traffic and shunt them around there. So
4:19:43 I think as a council I think we're looking into that and we're really helping that out with that. That's it.
4:19:51 Thank you Miss Strange.
4:19:54 Uh thank you Mr. Peterson. I'm going to follow up on what you're saying and go a little bit deeper. I am entertaining submitting a request to be on the agenda
4:20:03 to consider an ordinance that would um get rid of outdoor speakers. Okay. U without council's permission.
4:20:12 Um I have received complaints from more than one person, some of whom are unrelated who live in the downtown area.
4:20:19 And I'm also mindful in some conversations that I've had with the chief as we've talked about, you know,
4:20:25 future plans that DUIs are a big concern. One of our top um crimes, if you will, is that the officers are
4:20:33 they're one of the top ones in particular, they're one of the top ones that cause that actually cause damage that our police can help prevent. So,
4:20:40 what is the common denominator? People drinking until late at night and getting on the road. And so if we're encouraging
4:20:47 that behavior as a community by blasting loud music and attracting people to the party lifestyle versus what I'm hearing from citizens, which is nature,
4:20:57 peaceful, you know, a mature landscape,
4:21:00 hills and lakes, I'm inclined to move forward with an ordinance. Now, I have um reached out to some of the business owners downtown because I would much
4:21:08 rather see self-regulation than government regulation. That's kind of my philosophy, but I do think it's getting to a tipping point that I would support
4:21:17 an ordinance and may ask you to consider an ordinance that actually is a noise ordinance. And I have limited experience with it. So, I want to be prudent in how
4:21:25 I approach it. But, I'm going to go a step further and say that I'm I I'm willing to I'm almost at the point of willing to take action on it. Um,
4:21:33 my uh libertarianism is a little bit hesitant to do it, but I'm I'm getting close. Um, and related to your point, I do want to make sure the public is aware to keep an eye out for communications.
4:21:44 Um, my understanding is there's going to be another round of comprehensive plan community meetings coming up sometime in the near future. Um, those would be
4:21:52 citywide, not just the downtown. Um, so I know the staff is working really hard on that. So, I think that's exciting and I'm looking forward to hearing more
4:21:59 about it. Um, so I want to kind of again go just a step further on that. Uh,
4:22:03 reiterate what I mentioned at the CRA for purposes of this meeting notes. The Tourist Development Council for Lake County will be opening up its capital
4:22:11 fund with a target date of May 1st to have that process in place. I really, really want us to be looking at that.
4:22:18 Anything that brings visitors from outside the county to Clermont is something that would qualify for TDT tourist development tax capital funds.
4:22:28 So, I do want to make sure that we're thinking about that. And and it doesn't just have to be sports. It can be like the the CRA projects with the lake, the
4:22:36 botanical gardens, those things all the historical society with the museums, all of those fall under that category. Um I
4:22:45 am and I I'm open to council feedback on this one. I think because I'm excited about it, um I'm kind of in touch with
4:22:54 several different members of the community from several different areas around both the greenways, which is the trails, and also different parks
4:23:02 projects. Um I have gotten to the point where I've asked uh Mr. Van Wagner to um
4:23:08 encourage a a open meeting um kind of like the meet in the middle project where the public can come together um
4:23:15 and kind of put that feedback and generate their ideas. It's something I would like to be involved with at the beginning to help get it started. I'm
4:23:24 more interested in it being a a city-led citizen-led initiative, but um if it's something that any of you want to
4:23:31 participate in on the getting it off the ground, I'm happy to coordinate with staff to get that publicly noticed and make sure you're aware of it or if you're comfortable with me kind of
4:23:40 taking the reigns on that. I think we'll hear more about it. It's just right now it's very visionary and so I don't really It's ethereal. That's a much better word. Um,
4:23:50 so let me know if that's something that you want to be included in and and what I don't even know what it's going to look like right now, but I'm happy to engage everybody.
4:23:59 Um, and I certainly will keep you updated. And then the final thing is I met with Christian to go over the planning and zoning notes from our
4:24:07 workshop so that we can get that on, you know, the agenda amendment to the code.
4:24:12 He might be able or want to speak to at another meeting. It sounds like we're looking at June for PNZ. We're not going to see it by June. It'll be go to PNZ in June is most likely.
4:24:23 I prepared a draft today, but we'll see. We'll see. Okay. So, they might see it in May. So,
4:24:30 we might see be able to stick to that timeline, but uh it is a tight timeline.
4:24:34 So, I was Thank you. You're the best. Um so, that's my update. Thank you,
4:24:42 Mr. Bain. Thank you, Mayor. Um,
4:24:48 can can I ask uh for the city city manager, is it possible since we didn't get the presentations today, can we make
4:24:55 sure that we all get copies of the Main Street Clermont?
4:25:01 Yeah, we've already we already told Natalie that we'd get you a copy of Okay, thank you. Thank you. Um,
4:25:10 I have a I don't want to get into a conversation about it too lengthy given timing. Um, but I I've been reflecting a
4:25:19 lot about our workshop and then our flow of our meeting and I I recognize I tried to keep track of it tonight and I was
4:25:26 like, okay, I it's happening so much I can't even keep track of it. I think that when we don't have a flow of
4:25:35 who speaks when, we have it's just a free-for-all and so we just jump in because we don't know who's supposed to start. Mhm.
4:25:43 And we used to do that at planning and zoning uh where it was just kind of like you just went at it.
4:25:50 And um and we we started a process where each each uh item and I'm not saying we
4:25:58 need to do it each item because we have a lot of items, but essentially where we right now have an order. I believe the mayor probably has it because it does
4:26:07 seem to rotate. Uh so he's provided a list of who votes first on ordinances because it does rotate every time we have to vote with a roll call.
4:26:16 It's not always the same person. I is it always the same person who starts?
4:26:20 Well, when it come to roll call, I I I just go right down.
4:26:23 Okay. Somewhat. I I noticed we've rotated. So, I'm just wondering if I rotate.
4:26:28 I'm just wondering if a way for us to to try to not get frustrated because we don't know. We
4:26:36 don't know who's trying to speak and and we talk over each other and sometimes we don't even hear each other, the other person talking. that if we had a process where we could, hey, all right, this
4:26:45 meeting, Council Member Myers, you're the first, and we just then go the order, and then the next meeting it's council member Peterson, and then it's
4:26:53 council member Strange, and then it's me, and then it's And the chair always goes last because they're that they're they're not supposed to be engaged.
4:27:01 Are you talking time limits on these or just No, what's that? You're talking like the time limit?
4:27:05 Well, I mean, I think I have some ideas on maybe what we could do even more strategically with a first line of qu first round of of questions because I do
4:27:15 think questions should not be time bound, but I think statements could be time bound. And if we had a process by
4:27:22 which, you know, like let's just use this variance, uh, the Lionsgate variance, you know, if if if I were to go first, I would be up, I would ask my
4:27:30 questions and then council member Myers would ask their questions and then council member Peterson, council member Strange, and then the mayor and we would
4:27:38 get make sure we have all the questions and then I would get three minutes to make any statement I want to make about my vote, my concern, my frustration,
4:27:49 whatever it is. It's not a question, but it's a statement because I think sometimes we interweave them because that's just what we do. And that's where
4:27:58 maybe uh I think some defense mechanisms come into play of saying I don't want to cut
4:28:04 off timing because I could ask one question and Mr. Henchel could take 5 minutes to respond just because it it's
4:28:12 a hefty question and now my time's gone and it I don't want the clerk to be down there stopping and starting every time
4:28:18 we ask a question. But if I think there's some ways we can do that, I'm entertaining that. Maybe we can talk about it at a workshop upcoming. But I
4:28:27 think there are some ways that we could reasonably improve that would allow us to be more considerate and understanding
4:28:37 of time and perspectives and also I don't think anybody naturally likes to be interrupted and even when
4:28:46 it's unintentional but if it keeps happening then then that just grates on somebody and I'll speak for myself then I get like can I just speak please and
4:28:54 and then it just becomes a problem and so I'm just wondering if there's ways for us to do that. We don't have to get into it right now, but maybe if you're
4:29:01 willing and we could do a workshop our next devote some time to to talking about that at an upcoming workshop to improve some flows. There's even
4:29:09 microphone systems that that would allow the chair you can't even buzz in until you're it's your turn like your mic's
4:29:16 not active so you can't interject. Uh it just is you get to speak when you you know hey I want to call in and you're
4:29:25 called on. I'm not saying we have to go to that nth degree, but there are ways for us to maybe improve flow that
4:29:32 protects ability to ask questions, but also takes into consideration how long we can speak on statements of things
4:29:40 versus trying to seek information and and clarify and things like that. Um,
4:29:45 I like that. So, I'm just giving some thoughts out and maybe if it's okay, I can talk to the city manager and we can find out what our workshop schedule is and I'd be willing to put a few things
4:29:54 in writing and we hash it out if if I may. Yeah.
4:29:58 Um I know typically like when I first came on council, that's what threw me off because everybody just jumped in. Yeah.
4:30:05 And when I was on code enforcement as chair, you always had to wait for the chair.
4:30:10 The chair was the one that acknowledged you to speak. But that's not how it was when I got here. So you Oh,
4:30:15 and it will take some it will take some work on our part. We have to be diligent to it. But if we I feel like if we commit to it, we can hold each other accountable. Even a little even the
4:30:24 ribbing of like you weren't called on, you know, or I wasn't called on, right?
4:30:28 Uh but but you get to that flow and it allows us to be
4:30:34 a a less combative or confrontational process. And and that's the goal. I
4:30:43 think what I took away from that workshop last week. Uh yeah, you did this earlier and that was cool. Yeah, because it was like a signal.
4:30:51 Yeah,
4:30:52 I'm used to that. I had that on my pre that when I served back in Wisconsin that we had a call-in system and it's like ingrained in me that I'm like, "Oh, I don't have to do that." Actually,
4:30:59 I love everything you said and I would encourage you to take a look at our I would be open and I would not be offended at all if you took a look at
4:31:07 our rules and marked them up the way you thought consistent with what you said.
4:31:11 we can do a workshop or if you want to give us something, I'm I'm open to it.
4:31:15 Okay. I'm happy to maybe work with the staff and work on that and bring that back.
4:31:19 Okay. Um uh and then finally, I there was a I think we might need to address how we
4:31:27 handled boil notices and I think the deputy city manager I have talked a lot.
4:31:32 There was some work that was done over in the East Avenue, Aurelia, Cole,
4:31:36 Cypress Ridge yesterday that resulted in some water mane breaks. I think multiple
4:31:42 breaks at multiple times. Uh and um I know that city staff will always alert
4:31:51 someone if they have to boil. But the issue comes in is when like a note in this case a notice went out to Aurelia
4:31:58 Cole and then Aurelia Cole told parents and then that word spreads and I know we can't control that but when we are
4:32:05 silent on what area is actually affected and when we use our social media to do
4:32:10 that it it allows for more concern to be out there that maybe could have been proactively addressed. And I
4:32:19 think we have a process or procedure in place where if it's more than a certain number of people, we use social media. I just think that maybe that policy was
4:32:27 put in place prior to when social media was as active as it is. And so we maybe need to reook at that. And I I would
4:32:37 encourage staff to maybe adapt that more proactively to be that yes, there's a boil notice, it's this block, it's
4:32:46 this street, it's whatever. and we can't control what people are going to do with that, but at least we let people know rather than I got a bunch of calls. I
4:32:54 don't know if it's because I live in that area or whatnot, but I was getting calls saying, "Wait, my neighbor got something. I didn't. What does that mean?" And I see all these trucks out
4:33:02 here and and they just and I so I had to start making calls and it just created a longer process is if we could have just
4:33:09 put something out. Um, so sorry to be long-winded on that. I just think that it's something we need to think about moving forward to better serve our our
4:33:18 residents. Um because I think our staff want to make sure everybody knows. We just maybe don't have the policies or
4:33:25 procedures in place to use all the ways that we can do that. That's my report. Thank you.
4:33:31 Thank you, Miss Myers.
4:33:35 Good evening. Um last week I got to uh go to the FBC LEO conference. The mayor was there as well. and they gave me a
4:33:43 lot of ideas and um one of the ideas I want to share with you all to see how you all feel about it's pertaining our
4:33:52 youth. Um as you all know um we don't have this issue but I'm just going to say where it came from. First of all,
4:34:00 the mayor of Baltimore reduced the homicide rate there tremendously. And one of the things that he implemented
4:34:08 was having midnight basketball. And so I was thinking for the summer, could we do that for our youth to have midnight
4:34:16 basketball? I spoke with Chief Grac. He loved the idea. Um and I also um thought
4:34:23 of we could have like dance parties for them with different themes or whatnot for the summer just to you know have
4:34:30 them something positive to do. So that's one of the things that I wanted to share with you on that. And then the other thing is I would love for us to bring
4:34:40 Miss Doris back. Oops, I'm sorry. I would love for us to bring Miss Doris back. She's the one who was with us on our workshop to do the assessments. Um,
4:34:49 and I would like it to be an offsite retreat. Um, she said that she would need another probably a minimum of 90
4:34:57 minutes. So, I would like it to be offsite so that we don't have to rush because, you know, we've got this other agenda and that. Um, and I was thinking
4:35:07 maybe even include planning and zoning possibly because they seem to have benefited from it or whatnot as well.
4:35:13 So, I wanted to see what you all thought of that and we could get a consensus on that. And then um the other thing I just
4:35:21 wanted to um let our citizens to be aware of concerning property taxes, as you know, there's a lot of talk of doing
4:35:30 away with property tax. um that would have to come to um a vote on the ballot.
4:35:37 And so I know that it would sound good if oh I don't have to pay property tax,
4:35:42 but the downside of that it could it it would impact us. And two, I give you an example. For example,
4:35:50 if we don't have property tax, then one thing as a city we may have to implement is okay, well you want to go to the park here. Now, you're going to have to pay
4:35:59 to park. You're going to have to pay to use the facilities. Um, that type of thing. And so, I just want the public to be aware of that because I know it sounds good in theory to some people,
4:36:09 but, you know, not having property tax would just be very negative, you know,
4:36:14 with our budget for all of the services that we as a city provide and what our citizens have come used to. So, just
4:36:22 just to be aware of that. And you're probably going to hear me say it because I'm going keep saying it because I know I just want it just in case it comes back next year because you, you know,
4:36:29 they float the idea. It may not be this year, but it could come next year. So, I just want to educate the public on that if they're not aware of that. And last
4:36:38 but not least, I want to wish every mother a happy Mother's Day. I hope that
4:36:45 you're loved on. I want you to know that we appreciate you because without mothers, none of us would be here. And um I know most of us would probably say
4:36:53 we are products because of the mothering that we received whether it was from your biological mother or grandmother or aunt to your sister or whatnot. I just
4:37:01 want to say happy Mother's Day to you all. Thank you, Mr. Matthysse.
4:37:07 The only thing I have to add is just to piggyback on what um Mr. Van Wagner said about the recruitment company. We
4:37:15 checked with HR. HR has not heard anything either. They've not been in contact with anybody. So, no. No. Seems like nobody on staff has any knowledge of this.
4:37:25 That's it.
4:37:27 Okay. Thank you. I guess now for my report. Um as Mer say I I had the opportunity last
4:37:36 week to go down to FBC Leo. It was a great conference. I guess to me one of the best ones I've attended yet since I've been attending them. Um they
4:37:44 changed the format up but it was some great speakers and everything. I I got some great information and knowledge.
4:37:51 So, so I'm I'm willing. Uh she mentioned about what the uh mayor of Baltimore did with the youth
4:37:59 and everything. Of course, that thought me back brought me back to what I've been working with you on the youth council and that one of the whole things about the youth council and I think the
4:38:06 last report I got on that was the fact that you all maybe bring it back to us in July, was it?
4:38:11 Yeah, we it it's going to start I think it was September is when it starts. So,
4:38:14 we're going to start uh recruiting in August. July or August to start recruiting the youth. And so we're actually meeting with a couple of them.
4:38:22 Is it next? It's Monday. We're meeting with some potential members. So yeah, it'll it'll come back and it'll start again up again in September.
4:38:30 So maybe they can get that's some of the ideas we can throw the what Miss Mars just said is some of the ideas we can throw at the youth council because that's the whole idea behind the youth
4:38:39 council. Um of course it's been some time we've been trying to work on this,
4:38:42 get it started as well. uh so they can give us some feedback on things that they they want to see see happening for them in the city because as I often say
4:38:50 we did a lot of growth a lot of development here in this city but we've never done anything for our youth you know it's a lot of growth
4:38:59 going on but what have we done for our youth and we need we need to concentrate on them because they are our future uh I think you talked about the water main
4:39:06 break so I don't need to go there no more m I got a lot of calls about that yesterday and people concerned as well
4:39:13 about uh no bore notices. Didn't know what was going on there. I'm also getting uh Mr. Van Wagner also uh yesterday afternoon when I was leaving
4:39:22 city hall I got a couple complaints couple people complain to me about utility billing things going on in utility billing. So maybe we need to sit
4:39:30 down and look at that. Uh one of the biggest complaints is the fact they call here and the phone is ringing ringing ranging ranging. They never get chance
4:39:38 to call nobody. and when they do leave a me get chance to leave a message, they not not uh being call not being returned for two or three days and everything.
4:39:46 So, we we need to and I know that's always been a pro somewhat of a problem over there which we've looked at trying to what we need to do with improve
4:39:54 utility bill building and everything and uh but that that hit me yesterday as I was leaving city hall
4:40:01 yesterday a couple people and then actually was out in Kings last night and somebody came to me and complained to me about it as well. Um, Arts and Jazz
4:40:10 Festival was outstanding. I think city staff and uh, park and recreation, they did an outstanding job. I think when I suggested that last year and Mr.
4:40:20 Peterson suggested that last year, I don't think either one of us was expecting them to go all out like they did. But I got uh, plenty in good
4:40:28 complaints and uh, not complaints but compliments down there at the arts and jazz festival. And I was amazed because I actually stood there at the parking,
4:40:36 my wife and I. We stood there to helping helping them with parking and everything because uh on Saturday because it kind of like
4:40:44 got overwhelmed us there a little bit on Saturday. But uh as people was coming in from different places and getting off the guard cart so I was asking where
4:40:52 they were from and all this. I mean I had people tell me they were from Jacksonville, they were from Okeella, they were from uh St. Augustine, Tampa,
4:41:01 Sarasota. And the one lady that really got me was she said she was going she came to see Walter Beasley. Mhm.
4:41:08 Even though she knew Walter Beasley folk been playing first she was going to go to Pompet no beach cuz he was playing down there on Sunday but when she heard he was up here even though we was
4:41:16 charging and he was going to be freed out in pump. She came to clim.
4:41:20 So I said okay that that that make me feel good. But the only bad part about I was out at Earth Day this weekend. We had a great another earth great earth
4:41:27 day on Saturday. Um well I was at Earth Day. I was at the uh park run on Saturday morning at 7:30 Earth Day. What
4:41:35 else? I did the women women uh health fair. I guess they had down here Victory Point. I went by there. Uh also had
4:41:43 World Thai Tai Chi going on over there and I visited before I finally made it to our
4:41:51 school reunion on Saturday and everything. So, so I had a pretty busy day, but everybody was I got compliments and everything from just about
4:41:59 everywhere I stopped. They all complimented on the on the jazz festival. Then the biggest thing was they came back and they wanted a blues fest. Oh,
4:42:07 okay. So So uh hey,
4:42:11 I I just say I'll pass it on to staff of what people start asking about. They say it'd be great to have the jazz fest in in in the spring and then blues fest in the fall. So I just say I'll pass it on.
4:42:21 So that's one other thing. I have the mayor's lunchon coming up um next Tuesday and we will be at Gurus if I'm not mistaken at 12 o'clock next Tuesday
4:42:29 on the first Tuesday at 12:00. So, we're good. Uh Mr. W, you mentioned ebikes.
4:42:37 I think I to I think I talked to you before because I I am really concerned and I think you told me, but I wanted to bring it to the council's attention
4:42:45 anyway because on our trail, we got uh speed limits 15 miles an hour on that trail and I I think that's a little high
4:42:53 and everything and I know I spoke to you about it before and you were saying it's still within the limit because I think you say the log can go up to 19. We can
4:43:02 put up the 19, but I wanted to bring back the council and see what if you can give us some insight and let council know what the actual rule is. So,
4:43:10 can we go to 10 in that mile stretch from the boat ramp to Ho to the well, a mile and a half from the boat ramp to Hayawa?
4:43:18 Yes. I mean, you you could there there's a lot of options and you know, there's been talk about um banning, you know,
4:43:26 certain types of vehicles on trails and things like that. I think the Florida legislature is taking up some legislation on this as well. Um, capping
4:43:35 speed limits and things like that, but we as the city can always be more restrictive and I I think that's basically the intent. That's what I've
4:43:42 heard. So, we're talking actually uh collaborating with the police department on this as well and that's what we'll present.
4:43:49 And I say I thought the state had passed one ordinance and if it's over 9 miles an hour, they couldn't be on trails.
4:43:57 They had to be couldn't be on sidewalks.
4:44:00 They had to be on the streets and they had to have license. That's right.
4:44:03 See, so that's why, you know, when I I get out there and when I've been on the trail lately and I see these guys zipping past there, I mean man, they I
4:44:11 mean they zipping past you like crazy out there and then I look up and I see we got 15 m hour speed limit. I say I think it's Well, I'm drafting a ban to be honest. I
4:44:19 mean I'm drafting a ban on the trails and things. So I mean it'll be up to y'all but that's what I thought my direction was. Okay.
4:44:28 And other cities have done it, too. By the way, we're not reinventing. We looked at a bunch of other examples. Um there's some I think like I think Winter
4:44:35 Garden allows them, but uh there's other cities that just No, they're not going to put up with them. Can ebikes be cycled?
4:44:44 Can you ride them like a bicycle with your feet instead of the motor?
4:44:49 I mean, I'm sure that they make a type of those. There's so many different types.
4:44:55 Yeah. I mean, if you could b because you do see those people pedaling, but you know, that's not they're going faster than Yeah. Yeah.
4:45:01 I like the speed limit and and even if we had to make it five or six in that stretch of land, that's where people are doing their 5ks and running all the
4:45:09 time. And you want it to be slow enough so that an officer can just look at it and go, you're going to But that's the issue that the police department has. That's one of the
4:45:17 issues. One of the issues is our ability to enforce and so that's why it makes it easier.
4:45:24 Okay. Well, um, it makes it a little bit easier on certain portions of Clermont property to not allow it at all because
4:45:33 we may not have the mechanisms to stop people who are in violation. Sometimes I just don't I don't I just don't want to see somebody get hurt. And I know I
4:45:42 was a few years ago, we had elderly gentleman have an accident down there with a golf cart and everything and almost basically almost died on on the on the scene. They had to resurvive him.
4:45:52 So, and that's always been my my fear and everything with them going out there and some of them folks, I mean, they are zipping along pretty fast.
4:46:00 Yeah. Um,
4:46:02 Mr. Mayor, they they are it's getting dangerous. Yes, it's very getting very dangerous,
4:46:07 especially with some of the we have out there is is it's not the adults typically, it's the the younger. So, you're 100% right. We
4:46:15 experienced that the other night and it was dangerous. Okay. Okay. So, so we're looking at it. So, yeah, we can just take a look. Well,
4:46:21 whatever we need to do to try to get to get it taken out. And then another thing is we also have signs out there saying no motorized vehicle.
4:46:30 See, so so uh we saying 15 miles out, no motorized vehicle, but yet still they zipping up and down the place like
4:46:37 crazy. So I we just and I know I made a suggestion a while back about getting rid of the marine patrol, but I heard they came back and say no, they figured
4:46:44 out they can keep the marine patrol and figure out some way they can put somebody on the trail as well. So so we can try to enforce that. So, so that'll be great. All right. But let's let's
4:46:53 just keep our eye on it and whatever we need to do. Um,
4:46:58 Miss Miss uh Strange, there is already a code and ordinance and everything. They cannot They're on our books right now.
4:47:05 You're not supposed to have uh external microphone or speakers in the outdoor area.
4:47:11 It's it's it's already it's already there.
4:47:16 It's it's already there. But huh. Well, in the I know in the downtown area you you're not supposed to have
4:47:23 ampl we call it amplified music I figures and everything on the outside. Yeah, sort of.
4:47:29 Yeah, there's exceptions and we put them in cups before very specific language but in the standard code there's
4:47:37 and have a speaker outside. It's just regulated by the noise ordinance or ordinance. It has to be so so low, but uh but we we kind of restrict that down there. Um,
4:47:50 so no exterior, but we can I guess if we need to add some teeth to that, I guess we can go back and do that, too, and everything to that ordinance, but it's
4:47:58 one that's kind of like on the books already. Um, and that's pretty Oh, um, I talked about the blues fest. I talked about the water marine break and Mr.
4:48:08 Vain already brought that up. Ebikes and Okay, that's it. That's all I have. Um,
4:48:17 and hopefully I'm looking forward to the youth council and everything. I I keep a lot of people and I've been sending uh asking young people to come down and talk to you all about that. So, let's get it done.
4:48:26 Did Did we have a consensus? I saw people nodding, but if could about bringing Doris back for an event. Can I have that verbalized instead of just
4:48:35 nodding to make sure I'm if there's a consensus or not to do another event with Doris? Yes.
4:48:40 Yes. Uh, I'm just curious what the agenda would be, but I I do have a
4:48:47 problem going off site. I I think I I do think our if we're going to have a meeting, it should be somewhere where the public can access it and it be streamed.
4:48:56 That would be my Well, I'll I'll tell we have to do that whether it's offsite or not. You know,
4:49:00 in other words, y'all have the ability to have meetings at the Ark. you have meetings to, but it'd have to be open to the public
4:49:08 and um I mean it doesn't necessarily it doesn't have to be streamed.
4:49:13 Um we'd have to provide notice but for example, and it's getting in the weeds a little bit. If you wanted to have a a retreat that was open to the public, but
4:49:22 you had it in Fosta,
4:49:25 you wouldn't be able to. That would be a sunshine violation because it's too far from the people that you represent. So,
4:49:31 uh, yeah, you can do it offsite as long as it's around here. Whether you do or not is a policy decision. Okay.
4:49:38 I like the I like the idea of us, um,
4:49:41 having it offsite, not being under the gun and, um, to just to get the feedback that we need. If there needs to be like
4:49:50 correction, so to speak, we can have that, not be under the gun, you know.
4:49:54 Um, and she wanted to follow up. So because you know it was getting good and then we were out of time so to continue
4:50:03 what she was working on. Um but if she but she said if you wanted to do something else that's she's open to that as well but I would like it to finish
4:50:11 what she had started because we were out of time. So did we have a consensus?
4:50:20 Yeah.
4:50:20 I again my I I would not be in favor unless we can stream it. Um, so I don't know what that entails for our our
4:50:29 staff, but I think all of our Yeah,
4:50:32 I I have no problem doing what we did last time, doing it right here and everything and we just a lot more time a lot more time for and I I'm afraid
4:50:42 anything we do, we have to be in public eyes anyway. So, so I have no problem with what we did here. Um, of course, we
4:50:49 we tied our hands because we put a time 90 90 limit 90m minute time limit on it.
4:50:54 And of course going in there, I figured we weren't going to have much time. Yeah, we did.
4:50:59 Okay. And all and of course I was kind of watching the time and everything too.
4:51:03 And that's why, you know, I I can and I can tell she was too cuz she was starting to speed it up and everything.
4:51:07 But but um we just have a straight out uh workshop that deal with communication in two three hours and schedule it for two,
4:51:15 three hours and not put a time limit on it. Okay.
4:51:19 I had somebody say to me that it um gave them the impression that it was airing your dirty family laundry on the internet.
4:51:27 Yeah.
4:51:28 Um Yeah.
4:51:29 And it wasn't as a criticism. It was just in the context of when you're doing personal development and team building
4:51:37 and you need to be vulnerable and you're working on relationships.
4:51:42 um you know being as a person who's generally open and
4:51:49 honest like even I can feel like you know feeling safe I think is really
4:51:56 important and when you're in a fishbowl like I think we get a little bit accustomed to being up here in it but
4:52:03 um I don't I don't want to speak for you so I'll just speak for myself I think having that that that safety of being
4:52:12 even if we could agree we're not going to talk specifically about city business,
4:52:16 you know, or we won't use specific examples, I think that going away and being able to focus on each other and that relationship rather than on city business might be helpful.
4:52:30 I see your point, Mr. Bain. Totally.
4:52:34 I I see it. I just think what Ms. Myers is trying to do is help us have a better working relationship.
4:52:41 And and I do believe that having trust and openness and vulnerability is really important and being on the internet and
4:52:48 being streamed can can impede that for people.
4:52:54 Well, in that in that case, why instead of going off site, hey, why don't you you well, if the city's ready
4:53:03 and the council ready to pay for it, you just set up 90 minutes se session with it independently and everything and then she can compile everything and and and present it to us and everything. Well,
4:53:13 part of the point because that way we won't have to worry about, you know, you know, violating sunshine law because
4:53:22 Well, no, part of it was just for us to be able to work together because that was the point was to us to have understanding of when you say this, this
4:53:30 is how I feel. This is that may be interpreted this way. So, if you do it separately, you're not going to get that. But when you have eyes on you on the internet, I don't mind people here,
4:53:40 but on the internet, people can slice and dice that and use that against you.
4:53:44 Um, and that's what I don't want. I want to protect us so that we can let down that guard, so to speak. You know what
4:53:53 I'm saying? Because if you know it's it's on the internet, everybody sees you. You know that that's that's that's what I and I I don't want to berade
4:54:00 this. It's it's recorded. It it's still going to be recorded whether it's streamed or not. So someone could still take that recording and slice it and
4:54:08 still use those words. I just I'm uncomfortable inherently as a elected official conducting business.
4:54:18 If we stream, we stream. If we don't, we don't. And I don't want to I don't want to make exceptions for a retreat.
4:54:26 Um I it's still a meeting. It's still a public meeting in my mind. And that's just where I'm coming from it is that I just I hear what you're saying. I I want
4:54:34 us to be able to and we don't have the sunshine laws don't allow us to have those types of conversations outside of the public.
4:54:45 And I feel like if we're going to have the meeting, the meeting should be available like we do all of our meetings is just where I'm coming from on that.
4:54:52 And and and I hear that. My point is is that we didn't stream workshops last year because we didn't have the capability. in workshop, not just in and
4:55:01 with this is if we need to correct our advisory board that shouldn't be streamed. Now, people can sit here and the and the clerk will
4:55:11 make notes, but the notes are more detailed when it's an actual formal meeting than it is a workshop. And um I
4:55:18 just think we want people to be able to be more vulnerable and open to receive correction. And I don't think that you're going to do that if you have a camera on you. That's what I'm saying.
4:55:28 Because of course the public has to be here because the sunshine laws. I'm not saying not that. I'm just saying I don't think it needs to be streamed. That's my point.
4:55:38 Well, I don't have no problem because I cameras on me every day and they evaluate me every night. I sit up on this docket. So whether it's in a
4:55:45 workshop or this day of uh council meeting, they're watching me. And the other thing I also find that hey, every day I walk out there on the street, the
4:55:53 people is all always watching me. So uh doesn't matter to me if I'm still try to be myself and be who I am and I'm not
4:56:02 ashamed of anything I have to say or do and know. So to me it doesn't mean I kind of have to agree with Mr. vain because we are in the public eye and um
4:56:11 and because of Sunshine Law, I rather have everything out there open and upfront to people so they can see what we're doing and hear what we're doing
4:56:19 and and they won't as we as they always say to uh leave nothing for their imagination. I I
4:56:27 would say you know what what are we doing behind closed doors that they don't want us to see and everything. So I think that's what you open yourself up to when you start talking about you don't want to stream and everything. So,
4:56:37 what is it you're trying to hide? Okay.
4:56:39 At the risk of belaboring it, because I think this is an important question, how do we address the public perception of some of us being at off-site meetings,
4:56:49 whether it's League of Cities or or something along those lines together?
4:56:55 I mean, those aren't streamed. Those aren't noticed. They're not open to the public. there's an opportunity to sit at a a restaurant or a bar and and and have
4:57:04 a conversation at those meetings. And you know,
4:57:08 there are those those are opportunities that we don't send out to the public. And I'm not saying one's right or wrong. I see both sides of this. I just think that
4:57:16 that if the purpose of this is personal development and relationship building,
4:57:23 I don't see that as city business. I have been corrected by our city attorney and I accept that correction. Um, but I do think it walk it walks a line and I
4:57:31 think you make a valid point, Miss Myers, that it wasn't streamed in the past. And so I look at it as, you know,
4:57:36 to what degree and it might be that we just can't have those personal relationships because we can't develop them or it it might be that, you know,
4:57:48 we can do better and so something's better than nothing.
4:57:51 Um, so I think that that's just what we have to come to terms with. I mean that that's the that's the last thing I'll say is when we go to those conventions,
4:58:00 nobody's noticed, nobody's there, and there's no cameras. Yep.
4:58:03 Well, it's also not a it's not a city meeting, though. That's the thing. And
4:58:10 I think the same I forget the name of the conference you guys were just referencing, but the FBC LEO, they were both there, but it wasn't a city
4:58:19 meeting. And so if we are going to host a city meeting, regardless of what the meeting is, our policy right now is to
4:58:26 stream those meetings, I would like to continue to do that. Um, and I'm uncomfortable having a meeting where we
4:58:33 don't stream intentionally. Um, that that's just where I feel. Um and I think it's best to do that work in the public
4:58:42 eye in the public way that we continue to do that daily rather than make that exception when we know I think one of the
4:58:49 difference in that this public meeting here and going to a conference is the fact we coming together as a city so
4:58:57 people expect us to be talking city business when I go to the conferences even though we were just there together I think we spoke and talk but we never
4:59:04 talk about city business and that's one of the thing I think we was at conference uh in Orlando last time and Mr. Peterson was scared to sit was
4:59:12 scared for me to sit next to him in one of the little workshop because he he said what about what about sunshine law of course everybody around and say
4:59:20 you're not discussing city business so I said no we're not going to be we just listening to the lecture here so I think we even when we at the conference we are
4:59:28 aware of of the fact that sunshine law is there and we try to afford all that but goes back to what Mr. Bain say uh is
4:59:36 saying I it's the appearance of I guess you can say if we are hiding oursel and scared to scared to do this okay what what is
4:59:44 it you're trying to hide the appearance of so I don't have no problem uh streaming and showing right we didn't used to uh broadcast because we didn't
4:59:51 have the capabilities see we're doing a lot of things now that we didn't used to have the capabilities of and everything so so that's what's changing time and
4:59:59 and now the people want to see that and we have the capabilities and they want to see Okay. So,
5:00:07 but I don't have no problem bringing her back if that's what you all want to do um for a session. Uh if that's what the consensus you're looking for.
5:00:23 Anything else? Okay. If not meeting a journ I'm signing paper.